Wiring in a 12v blower

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Buckeroo Bob
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:? Sure, it's probably simple to do, but I'd like to know how to easily wire my new 12v blower into my 36v system. If there is a diagram involved, please don't use electical symbols. I'd prefer good old names etc. Thanks for any help.

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mr_exon
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Maker of the Ex-Volt1500 and Ex-Volt1500z
option 1.....

if you have 3 12volt cells in your set up, just solder your power wire and switch to one of the 12v cells.... very simple and easy!
Note.......dont use the blower all the time, it will make the cell you have it wired to drain more then the rest of the cells....(not good!)

option 2.....

if your running a 36volt battery and it is all one cell, then you will have to get a voltage regulator, look for one on a golf cart parts site or a tow motor site
Note.....voltage regulators come in all sorts of sizes, i recomend one that is just enuff amps so it wont take away from your bikes power too much! they can be costly too, 45-over 100 ducks easy....

both options you should have a switch hooked up. the more junk you run on your power cells the shorter time you have to ride. lol i put a h4 light on my bike using option 1, it works great, but i do see a big diffrance in run time when it is on at night, lol it takes 10amps to turn it on lol

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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

I'm running a 36v system (motor) using 3 12v batteries. I didn't think there was a way to just tap into a 12v portion of the 36 volts. Maybe I do need the voltage regulator, eh?

mr_exon
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

use step one, hook up a swich to it....

if you want to test it befor you wire one of the cells up, just turn the scooter on and take a volt ohm meter to the cell you would like to take voltage from for the blower motor....It will read 12 volts....lol trust me, i already did this once my self(not the blower but the voltage thing)

just remember, use this as an option you can turn on and off, it really wont hurt the cell, the charger should level the cell that has lower power when the 36v charger gets hooked up.....if you want to make sure it wont hurt the batteries, put it on a diffrnt gell cell once every while...

Maker of the Ex-Volt1500 and Ex-Volt1500z

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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Dang! It doesn't seem like it should work like that, but I'm the assbackwards builder around here. I'll give it a try and thanks for persisting with the explanation. And my son is an EE from Purdue. Everything about computers...nothing about motors, etc. Thanks again.

chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

I have used a cheap 36-volt scooter controller to run lights. It should be easy to use it for a 12-volt blower motor and pull the power from the whole pack so you don't destroy one battery. If you tape off of one battery it will not take long to destroy that battery. Been there done that. I bought a cheap scooter controller and used a 5K pot from Radio Shack to set the output voltage to 11.5-volts with the load attached. Then I put a switch from the battery to the controller so when I was not using my lights the controller was off and not using any power from the batteries. Here is where I bought my controller. (scroll down the page to see the 36-volt controllers)

Here is a picture that may help.

I think this will work.
Chas S.

mr_exon
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

that is a great idea......
controlers are cheep too....you should be able to put both controlers on the same battery right, does not seem that it would mess with the other controler.....agen great idea

Maker of the Ex-Volt1500 and Ex-Volt1500z

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Fechter
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Oops wrong spot. No way to delete. See below.

Fechter
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Hi Bob,
It would help to know how big is the blower you are trying to run?

If it's a tiny little thing like I use on my scooter motors, you could possibly get away with a simple resistor in line with one of the wires to drop the voltage.

The "cheap controller" route will certainly work with any size blower.

Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

What I have is a Nidec Gamma 30 Model A34124 12v .65amp squirrel cage blower. Now what? And thanks for the assist. Bob

Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Thanks for going to all the trouble to make that nice diagram. I can understand better the illustrations. Ha! The controller I'm using is an overkill unit I bought from Craig when he was liquidating his inventory. so I'm not sure this diagram would apply to my equipment. Thanks again. Bob

reikiman
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

While you could tap 12v off one of the batteries ... as ChasS said in one of the comments that will damage the pack. This is because the battery you tap off of will have power drawn from it more deeply than the others, and that battery will discharge deeper than the others. The other batteries will then get into a state of having to work harder because the more deeply discharged battery isn't providing as much current as the others. The technical term is "unbalanced pack".

There's a couple ways I know to address this ...

One is, as ChasS said, to work out a way to run your lighting etc at the full pack voltage rather than 12v.

Another is to use a DC-DC converter that takes your full pack voltage and produces 12v.

The last is the powercheq battery management thingy. The powercheq thing automagically balances batteries in a pack by detecting voltage differences and shuttling power back and forth. You could tap 12v off one of the batteries, and the powercheq will keep the pack balanced.

- David Heron, http://davidherron.com/

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chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

David and others,

David said -

Quote:

The last is the powercheq battery management thingy. The powercheq thing automatically balances batteries in a pack by detecting voltage differences and shuttling power back and forth. You could tap 12v off one of the batteries, and the powercheq will keep the pack balanced.

FYI

I am using PowerCheqs on my bikes and I contacted the manufacture with this idea and they told me if the load on the tapped battery is greater than 10-watts the PowerCheq would not be able to keep-up with the balance requirements. They said they did not recommend using the PowerCheq in this manner.

Chas S.

reikiman
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Ah... good point. The powercheq has a limit of 2A current in moving power back and forth.

- David Heron, http://davidherron.com/

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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

BTW, here is a diagram of how I have the scooter wired. This was provided by Craig U. awhile back and works well. Thanks, Bob

Fechter
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

I'll try posting this again,
Here's a dc-dc converter that would work well. I run my Nidec Gamma 28 on 15v with no problem, but this one can be adjusted with resistors to ~13.5 if you want.
The wiring is simple, 36v in, 15v out.
From:C and H Sales Company
For $6.50, you can't go too far wrong. As I recall though, C and H has a minumum order amout that's more than that, so you have to go shopping and find something else you want.

DC TO DC CONVERTER DC to DC CONVERTER LUCENT/TYCO, #JW030C1-M. Output is 15 VDC @ 2 amps. (30 watts) with trim adjustment that allows a ±10% voltage adjustment via external adjustment trimmer. Digital on/off control pin is provided. Input voltage 36 to 75 VDC (0.95 amps). Line and load regulation ± 0.1% max. Over-current, over-voltage and thermal protection. Average efficiency 90%. Printed circuit mounting with integral electrically isolated heat sink. Dimensions: 2-1/4’’ wide x 2-3/8’’ high x 1/2’’ deep. The connecting pins extend 7/32" below the bottom of the case Stock #PS2401 $6.50

Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

I'm back at working on this scooter. I tried Charles's suggestion, but couldn't get it to work. I think my controller was damaged when the original motor fried. Who know! Anyway, I have purchased the DC-DC converter suggested and would like to know the correct way to wire it in with a switch. I'm not sure which side of the converter should have the switch or should I just let it be wired into the main on/off switch for the scooter? Probably a "no brainer", but remember who's asking! For the record, I'm doing much better at restoring my old motorcycles than I am with the electrics. Ha!IMG_6035.jpg

I know the "voltage in" and "voltage out" connections, but I don't know how the other terminals fit into the equation. Any help would be appreciated.IMG_6036.jpg

reikiman
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

I've got some DC-DC converters like that.. I showed them to you when I visited. What I've done is wire up only the IN +/- and OUT +/- and install them in a box for protection. I haven't tested it but I'm hoping those other pins don't make any difference.

I have seen at both the thunderstruck motors and EVparts.com web sites that both offer a $30 DC-DC converter which is already built into a box and has just the IN and OUT wire pairs and look to be very very simple to wire up.

I would say the IN side of the DC-DC should be switched. That way you're certain there isn't any current leakage in case the DC-DC circuit has some activity in it even though the OUT side is not being used.

- David Herron, http://davidherron.com/

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chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

After looking at the DC to DC converter I came up with this wiring diagram. Hope this helps.

Chas S.
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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Thanks Charles, I was just getting ready to fire off another question because just hooking up the 4 wires does not get any 15v output. You've answered the switch question I was about to ask. Do you suppose I can let the 12v fan just run at 15v without a problem? Or are they sensitive to 25% overvolting? If so, what would I use for the voltage adjust? Too many questions, I know. I have an inquiring mind and a need to know! :? And what is used for adjusting the sensitivity? The switch alone doesn't seems to get things working.

chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

B Bob,

I was guessing the switch needed to be connected to the plus wire as most items like this do and the negative (minus) is off. If the switch is doing nothing then I might be wrong and I would try it the other way around. Maybe this device needs ground (minus) connected to the on/off connection for the units to operate. I would try this as it may be what the unit wants to see. It's a 50/50 chance. It will either work or it won't. This is my best guess.

Let me know how this works.
BTW I am looking for one of these where did you get it?

Good luck,
Chas S.
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Gman
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

`
Will this help?

Lucent JW030C1-M DC-DC Power Module Spec Sheet

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chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Gman has the answer in the data sheet. After reviewing the data sheet here is a revised picture of how to wire the DC to DC Power Module.

Thanks to Gman!

Chas S.
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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Yes, I think it is mega overkill information, but I thank for you looking it up.

Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Ah! Let's give this one a try. Thanks for the prompt assistance. This forum is a real lifesaver, not to mention equipment saver.

shock.gif

Now, here is a 150k 1.5watt potentiometer I found. Will this work as a voltage adjuster?
thb91729.jpg

chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

B Bob,

That should work just fine.

I like your shock picture.

Chas S.
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PJD
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

but everyone failed to notice that it was only .65 amp/12V, or 7.8 watts. So, just hooking it to one of the 12V batteries (not "cells") in the string and using powercheqs would have worked fine.

chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

PJD,

In an earlier post I made I wrote to the manufactures of the PowerCheq about using them to help balance the batteries when a 12 volt accessory was connected to one of the batteries in the string and there response was negative and did NOT recommend using the PowerCheq in this manner.

Chas S.
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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Thanks re. the picture. Can you tell me if this is the correct wiring for the potentiometer? The 5k one I bought and tried had no markings, so I assume the wiring is universal and known to EE folks. But, since I'm not one of them, I need to ask if the picture shown is correct. Thanks for bearing with me.thb91729_0.jpg

chas_stevenson
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

The ends do not matter either end can be plus or minus but the one in the center is the adjustment and must go to the trim connection.

Chas S.
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Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Wiring in a 12v blower

Thanks very much! Makes sense, but I didn't want to take a chance of ruining a hard to get part.

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