ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

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MEroller
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

OK, so I am now slightly relieved reading about the REAL speed of the 8kW bikes, as it is practically the same as my 72V 5...8kW Thunder. And I must say that with just 115A maximum current you indeed miss out on some serious fun in the range of 30 to 55 REAL km/h. My Thunder will draw up to almost 160A for a moment in that range, but usually of course it stays way below that with a maximum also in the 115 to 120A range. Uphill can differ, sometimes taking a little over that, and full blast (which is ONLY dependent on voltage and the usual bits of drag) around 80A too. And my new controller has also let the bike shed it's snail-like take-off from standstill and feels pretty much the way you describe your Sevcon beast.
Your speedo would be illegal on European roads.
The rule is as follows: actual speed + actual speed/10 + 4km/h. Showing less than actual speed is prohibited.
I.e. at real 80km/h the maximum allowalble speedo display would be 80 + 80/10 + 4 = 92km/h. Any reading above that would not conform to Directive 75/443/EWG. Please, all you E-Scooter assemblers under the sun, see to it that NONE of the speedometers that leave your factories exagerate more than that!

__________________

My rides:
E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables - repaired again :-)

QvR vR one: a Swiss package of pure understatement - innocent and to some eyes (from some angles) exceedingly ugly looks, but with raw and hardly containable electron power up to real 95 to 100km/h! And a literally rock-hard suspension due to a carrying capacity of twice it's unladen weight...

MEroller
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Points: 663
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

pcarlson1979 wrote:

* install a way to switch the motor from delta to star configuration to use less power and get a higher top speed. This can be done just by switching the phase windings with some contactors. Delta (default) winding is good for torque but not high speed. Star is better for high speed, uses less power at high speed, but it lacks torque.

I am quite convinced it is the other way round: our motors are operated in star or Y-configuration, thus giving us high startup torque (if the controller doesn't strangle that) but limited top speed. A delta configuration would be the other way round: less low-RPM torgue, but higher RPM due to less back-EMF.
By the way, I recently measured the idle max RPM of my bike to be about 1105 with 76V from the battery pack. That translated to a circumfrence speed of around 103km/h. At 0Nm torque left to drive anything apart from the motor itself. So the speed promise of my importer E-Sprit of 95...100km/h could only be attained on a rather steep downhill gradient, with just enough juice to make it to real 86km/h at 25°C ambient temp. on level ground.
Higher speed needs higher voltage, so four more cells (~84V) should be be able to push these bikes to slightly over real 100km/h. And with a delta configuration maybe even a bit more...

Again, please, all you E-scooter assemblers out there, don't lie to us about the true top speed of your electric rides, as we will find out and give you negative press in places such as these!

__________________

My rides:
E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables - repaired again :-)

QvR vR one: a Swiss package of pure understatement - innocent and to some eyes (from some angles) exceedingly ugly looks, but with raw and hardly containable electron power up to real 95 to 100km/h! And a literally rock-hard suspension due to a carrying capacity of twice it's unladen weight...

antiscab
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Points: 1603
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

pcarlson1979 wrote:

* increase voltage to around 132v with a 115A limit. (15kw). Top speed will be about 130km/h
* install a way to switch the motor from delta to star configuration to use less power and get a higher top speed. This can be done just by switching the phase windings with some contactors. Delta (default) winding is good for torque but not high speed. Star is better for high speed, uses less power at high speed, but it lacks torque.

the hub motors aren't true sine wave, so putting them in Delta is bad news (high recirculating currents).
if necessary you could have multiple windings and go from series to parrallel, but simply getting a bigger controller is usually easier.

you may run into a continuous power problem if trying to maintain higher top speeds,
but bigger hub motors are available.

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

MEroller wrote:

I am quite convinced it is the other way round: our motors are operated in star or Y-configuration

Oops, yes, my error. Star gives higher low end torque and delta gives the higher top speed, as used in the White zombie drag car and DoctorBass' electric bike.

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

antiscab wrote:

the hub motors aren't true sine wave, so putting them in Delta is bad news

The motors aren't sine wave? I know the chinese controller out-putted a square wave PWM, hence the , BZZZZTTT as it gained speed, but the Sevcon may output a sinewave (or a good approximate) hence the whisper quiet sound. I'm not willing to do any serious 'mods' to the scooter. I'm happy with what it does. I just wish I could fit 28x 100Ah CHL cells in this puppy along with a 20A charger, that would put an end to my range anxiety :) But who knows, after 10 years of happy e-scootin' CHL may have new batteries with more power density and IFI motors may have a 10kw motor that is more efficient?

I now have 890km on the scooter without any problems! Just goes to show PDT have put together a nice bike....and I've made it better with a fully functioning Cycle Analyst.

I have asked the dealer to give me a price on a 20A charger so instead of 5 hours to charge my flat pack (50Ah) it will only take 2.5h.

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

Johnny J
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Points: 333
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I have an RMP counter as well and will test my scooter as soon as I can, could be interesting to see if the 8KW motor and Sevon will give more RPM or not...

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

With my scooter on the center stand, at full throttle it sounds like the bike is going to fall apart because at full no load speed (99km/h as per cycle analyst) the back EMF must be huge because the motor stutters violently like it's not sure whether to apply voltage or to start regen? And then when you slow down to 0km/h the wheel will continue to go back and forth until you hold the brake. I will get a video and upload it to youtube so you can see what I'm talking about.

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Hi people,

I am wanting to charge my scooter at 20amps. The scooter has a 10A charger at the moment, I am getting a price an a 20A charger. But would there be a problem with connecting two 10A chargers to the battery in parallel?

I only have the one charger at the moment so this is just a thought.

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

IFIMotors
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Points: 40
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I think after all your test it will fly to the moon and back 
When you test the scooter on the center stand there is no load, since the automatic regen is working.
If no regen is applied the wheel will turn normally.
If you are interested in testing the scooter on manual regen please apply to PDT importer Eric to understand how it’s done.

IFIMotors
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Points: 40
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

We are using the same odometer the only difference is the display, on my testing I got only 5% difference.
I couldn’t drive any faster but the difference is similar all the way.
I as well made the recording of the ride and I got top RPM to 1085 and it matches the speed.
I recommend to re do this test on your end IMG00074-20111011-1107.jpg

IFIMotors
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Points: 40
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

You have a 10A onboard charger to replace to 20A is changing the internal structure of the scooter. If you want a fast charger I recommend an external charger of 50A 72V that will give you one hour charge.
To do so you will have to create a high current charging socket and protect the cables because a shortcut will be like lightning.
In Israel we installed a fast charger on every Pizza Hut shop to give charging boost if needed. A one hour charge is normally 1C so it’s not damaging the battery but its high current be careful.
You will need as well to make the proper connection to your home electricity mains grid.

Johnny J
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Can someone please verify my calculations for RPM (1085) to km/h?:

Rim: 13 inch = 33,02cm
Tire: 130/60/13, 130 x 0,6 = 78mm x 2 = 15,6cm
Total Diameter: 33,02 + 15,6= 48,62cm
Radius: 48,62 x 3,14 = 152,67cm
Km/min: 0.0015267km x 1085RPM = 1,6564
Km/h: 1,6564 x 60= 99,38?

MEroller
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J, your calculation is pretty much spot-on. I recon with 1.558m circumfrence. And I find the 1085 RPM DURING ACTUAL RIDING quite sensational for a 24cell LiFePO4 Battery with the ZAP/Erider Motor, in the light of my measured 1105 RPM having given me almost -76V back-EMF, with just a few V left to rotate the wheel...
The Sevcons are known to have trouble at the max. RPM limit, so pcarlson's obervations do not surprise me.

__________________

My rides:
E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables - repaired again :-)

QvR vR one: a Swiss package of pure understatement - innocent and to some eyes (from some angles) exceedingly ugly looks, but with raw and hardly containable electron power up to real 95 to 100km/h! And a literally rock-hard suspension due to a carrying capacity of twice it's unladen weight...

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I will work out a way to try and get a photo like that. I will have to use my iphone as a GPS, I'm sure there will be a GPS based speedo app.

I made my normal 6km ride into work this morning, most of it is 80km/h (although 80 on my speedo is 67km/h on GPS) and my "fuel economy" was 57.9Wh/km. That gives me a range of 62km which sounds about right at that speed

72v x 50Ah = 3600Wh
3600Wh / 57.9Wh = 62.18Km

compared to the 60Ah (GBS) pack I thought I was getting

72v x 60Ah = 4320Wh
4320Wh / 57.9Wh = 74.61Km

But from what I've heard about GBS batteries lately I'm happy to have the CHL cells. I really wanted 60Ah though, ah well, 10 years time I may be able to throw in 130Ah cells??

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J wrote:

Can someone please verify my calculations for RPM (1085) to km/h?:

Rim: 13 inch = 33,02cm
Tire: 130/60/13, 130 x 0,6 = 78mm x 2 = 15,6cm
Total Diameter: 33,02 + 15,6= 48,62cm
Radius: 48,62 x 3,14 = 152,67cm
Km/min: 0.0015267km x 1085RPM = 1,6564
Km/h: 1,6564 x 60= 99,38?

Must be pretty spot on with that 99.38Km/h because that's what my Cycle Analyst sticks to with no load, the odd glimpse of 100km/h but usually 99.something km/h

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

IFIMotors wrote:

You have a 10A onboard charger to replace to 20A is changing the internal structure of the scooter. If you want a fast charger I recommend an external charger of 50A 72V that will give you one hour charge.

Installing a 20A charger would be easy. As for the 50A external charger I'd LOVE to but don't have the capability as I only have a 32A circuit going to my oven, not my back door. I have a 15A circuit near the back door where I charge our 2 scooters and a 20A charger (87.6v x 20A X 1.05pF = 1839watts which at 240v is only a 7.7A load). My wife is happy with the current 10A charger.

Wow 50A charger! Now I can really see why these scooters are perfect for pizza deliveries. A 10 minute charge would put about 10 or 11 km back into the battery!!

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

IFIMotors wrote:

If you are interested in testing the scooter on manual regen please apply to PDT importer Eric to understand how it’s done.

No, that's fine. I was pretty sure the 'jitter' was from regen kicking in. I love the regen on this bike perfectly just how it is. It's the best implementation I've seen so far (except for Vectrix). It lets you VARY the amount of regen you want, much better than just on/off.

The bike does seem very "sluggish" from 0km/h, my 500w ebike can leave it for dead. Is Eric able to fix this. I rode the erider 4000w and it had EXCELLENT low end torque! But this bike has very little. This bike on a slight incline will sometimes struggle and take nearly 10 seconds to cross an intersection and cars always get cranky behind me for being too slow. When it struggles you start to move and then you feel it 'cut' the power after moving 10cm.

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

IFIMotors wrote:

We are using the same odometer the only difference is the display, on my testing I got only 5% difference.
I couldn’t drive any faster but the difference is similar all the way.
I as well made the recording of the ride and I got top RPM to 1085 and it matches the speed.
I recommend to re do this test on your end IMG00074-20111011-1107.jpg

Here are the results of my speedo, GPS certified and the GPS is EXACTLY what my Cycle Analyst reads.

The speedo is accurate at 20km/h
20 kph.png

At 31 km/h the speedo reads 40km/h (29% error)
31 kph.png

At 36 km/h the speedo reads 49km/h (36% error)
36 kph.png

At 62 km/h the speedo reads 70km/h (13% error)
62 kph.png

At 81 km/h the speedo reads 97km/h (20% error)
81kph.png

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

LeftieBiker
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Points: 655
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

That looks like the same panel as the ZEV, but the Speedos are different, as are the instruments in the round cutouts on each side.

Hey IB, you have both a ZEV and a CA. Have you compared the readings yet?

Johnny J
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Points: 333
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J wrote:

I have an RMP counter as well and will test my scooter as soon as I can, could be interesting to see if the 8KW motor and Sevon will give more RPM or not...

Well, today I tested my scooter and the max RPM on the center stand is 1326!

That would equal a theoretical max speed of 121km/h, so maybe it will do 100+, will know in a week or two. :-)

pcarlson1979
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Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J wrote:
Johnny J wrote:

I have an RMP counter as well and will test my scooter as soon as I can, could be interesting to see if the 8KW motor and Sevon will give more RPM or not...

Well, today I tested my scooter and the max RPM on the center stand is 1326!

That would equal a theoretical max speed of 121km/h, so maybe it will do 100+, will know in a week or two. :-)

So what kind of controller and motor do you have on your scooter? Is it a sevcon 8kw with CHL cells? I'd be interested to see if you can go faster. Do you have a cycle analyst?

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

Johnny J
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Points: 333
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

It´s the Sevcon 8018, CHL and propably the same motor as you have.
Have you tested your RPM with the scooter on the center stand?
If you have lower RPM it´s most likely a controller programming issue.
I have no CA, maybe in the future if the new BMS functions doesn´t cover my needs.

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J wrote:

Well, today I tested my scooter and the max RPM on the center stand is 1326!

That would equal a theoretical max speed of 121km/h, so maybe it will do 100+, will know in a week or two. :-)

Do you have an RPM gauge?

Ok so I set my wheel setting to 1666mm on my cycle analyst to give me RPM's and maximum RPM'S before regen starts kicking in is around 1100 rpm.

On a side note, I went for a 68.4km ride today and my fuel economy was 53.6Wh/km (85.76Wh/m)

I finally hit 1000km today!!

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

CHL lithium battery
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

In China,our GPS from cell phone test top speed to be 100.3km/h,see attached
GPS speed.jpg

Johnny J
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

pcarlson1979 wrote:
Johnny J wrote:

Well, today I tested my scooter and the max RPM on the center stand is 1326!

That would equal a theoretical max speed of 121km/h, so maybe it will do 100+, will know in a week or two. :-)

Do you have an RPM gauge?

Ok so I set my wheel setting to 1666mm on my cycle analyst to give me RPM's and maximum RPM'S before regen starts kicking in is around 1100 rpm.

On a side note, I went for a 68.4km ride today and my fuel economy was 53.6Wh/km (85.76Wh/m)

I finally hit 1000km today!!

Yes, have one of those laser RPM gauges where you put a small piece of reflective tape on the wheel, they are quite cheap, maybe around 50USD.

MEroller
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Pcarlson, your Sevcon is HEAVILY reined in current-wise, it is a shame for this extremely powerful controller to be so brutally curbed! Speak with your dealer to see if he is willing and has the ability (i.e the Sevcon programming unit) to fiddle with the controller settings. My Kelly-equipped Thunder with the original slightly undersized KEB72201 controller (100A continuous, 200A peak) also suffered from absolutely sluggish startup but drew up to 160A peak from the battery during acceleration and was thus an oxymoron of sorts: when starting from even just a slight upward gradient I had to push-start the thing with mine own legs instead of taking advantage of 160Nm standstill torque that our motor produces with just just 60A, but it accelerated like hell as soon as it hit 25km/h.
That is now done and over with thanks to the bigger brother KEB72801X with 150A continuous and 350A peak, despite the fact that we had to strongly limit maximum battery current to 35% of 350A=122.5A in order to keep the actual battery current peak below 160A as before. But takeoff from standstill is now according to the true capability of our motor. This morning at a traffic light I left a 250cc scooter well behind me until the speed limit and traffic allowed him to catch up, and I could even start from standstill and accelerate on the 20% gradient up to my dealer's place which is about 50m up this steep slope. With the orignal controller I had to take the 90 degree turn at the base of that slope in full stride to just barely make it to his entrance before the speed died down to a standstill. My Fury-Thunder is finally true to it's names performance-wise :-)
Of course the motor leads heat up on such a steep slope, we measured 67°C a few minutes after I had ridden up there. So if you should intend to constantly speed up 20% gradients this kind of mod should not be done, but as I said normal riding does not stress battery nor motor any more than before, that inital burst is over in just 2 to 3 seconds and the normal brutal acceleration continues from there.

The PDT Sprinter Thunder should be capable of up to barely 100 real km/h with a 50..60Ah 72V CHL battery, but again only if that little Sevcon controller is not limited to anything below it's nominal specification. That Johnny J's Thunder-wheel spins to over 1300 RPM in idle is a pretty good indicator that it should easily top my bike's 86km/h maximum at optimal bettery temp.

__________________

My rides:
E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables - repaired again :-)

QvR vR one: a Swiss package of pure understatement - innocent and to some eyes (from some angles) exceedingly ugly looks, but with raw and hardly containable electron power up to real 95 to 100km/h! And a literally rock-hard suspension due to a carrying capacity of twice it's unladen weight...

MEroller
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Joined: 09/26/2011
Points: 663
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

CHL lithium battery wrote:

In China,our GPS from cell phone test top speed to be 100.3km/h,see attached

How dependable are the GPS signals in China? The system allows for intentional regional inaccuracies according to the operators' will...
I also received this track from your neighbor and carefully analysed it. Can you explain to me why the topography is completely asymmetric even though it was a ride from your factory to a spot in the northeast and back exactly the same way to the factory? The speed chart does show the expected symmetry, but the topography is completely off. This lets me doubt the accuracy of the speed recordings also.

__________________

My rides:
E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables - repaired again :-)

QvR vR one: a Swiss package of pure understatement - innocent and to some eyes (from some angles) exceedingly ugly looks, but with raw and hardly containable electron power up to real 95 to 100km/h! And a literally rock-hard suspension due to a carrying capacity of twice it's unladen weight...

pcarlson1979
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Offline
Joined: 02/20/2011
Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Johnny J wrote:

Well, today I tested my scooter and the max RPM on the center stand is 1326!

That would equal a theoretical max speed of 121km/h, so maybe it will do 100+, will know in a week or two. :-)

Wow, Are you running a 24 pack 72v CHL cells? (Peak charge of 87.6v)

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
pcarlson1979's picture
Offline
Joined: 02/20/2011
Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

MEroller wrote:

This morning at a traffic light I left a 250cc scooter well behind me

Well, this morning at a traffic light I had a 50cc Piaggio leave me behind. He accelerated faster than me and could hold 80km/h easier than me. Noisy though!! and it smelt bad.

But I don't like driving full throttle as it burns Amp/hours!

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

pcarlson1979
pcarlson1979's picture
Offline
Joined: 02/20/2011
Points: 461
Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Here's some more photo's

Here I have moved the red and green lights down to install the Cycle Analyst (I slipped with the dremel and made that scratch). The black button is to turn the CA backlight on and off.
CA button.jpg

As promised, here is a photo of the "connection box". The 3 phases from the controller go in the top and the wires from the motor go in the bottom. You can see how the black cowling was 'scraping' on the motor phase wires and also under full suspension the cowling would hit the connection box and it cracked the cowling. So I cut out a big chunk so nothing touches the connection box anymore.
connection box.jpg

I have finally reached 1000km!! This was at the end of a big ride yesterday to pick up some concert tickets. Most of the ride was at 80km/h and a lot of steep hills which you don't notice in a car on cruise control!
fuel econ at 1000km.jpg

__________________

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS - 13 October 2012

"Scrappy" - Custom 48v Electric Dirtbike Conversion
20 Feb 2012: Bought 2005 Suzuki DRZ-400SM Motorcross Bike for $100
Motor: MARS ME0708
Controller: Alltrax AXE4844 400A controller
Battery: 16xCHL 50Ah LiFePo4 = 48v

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