Extension Cords

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Lionstrike
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Joined: 12/19/2011
Points: 74

Can anybody recommend a commerfocial extension cord in the US that plays nice with the vectrix about 10ft lon I don't want a blown up charger.

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HarryS
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Joined: 10/08/2008
Points: 341
Re: Extension Cords

There is way too much hype about this. The bike draws hust shy of 1800 Watt max, Comes out to aout 1750. At 120V thats 14.6 A. To stay within the 15Ah of your fuse and rating of a cheap cord you can afford the voltage to drop to 116V. It will not drop more over 10 feet. Any decent extension cord will work for just a 10foot Extension. I wouldn't even worry. If you like to go 25 feet or longere I suggest using a 12 AWG cable as opposed to a 14AWG. I do this all the time without any issue. BTW worst case scenario is a tripped fuse in your breaker box.

Anderson
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 134
Re: Extension Cords

You can't go wrong with a 10 guage cord, the 25' cord is on sale but in the Vectrix manual it says to not use an extention cord when it is coiled. I've taken the plug off the Vectrix cord and it only uses 14 guage wire. I guess it's alright to coil the Vectrix cord because it's shielded.

http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/25-15-amp-extension-cord/57415 25' 10 gauge extention cord on sale

http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-10-Gauge-Indoor-Outdoor-Orange-Extension-Cord-with-Lighted-Ends-/120852748311?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&h... 10' 10 gauge extention cord

reikiman
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Joined: 11/19/2006
Points: 8456
Re: Extension Cords

As the others said - the skinnier cables (14 gauge or thinner) are less expensive, but force the charger to attempt to draw more current, eventually tripping circuit breakers. It's better to go with as thick a cable as you can.

It's not about brand name really but about the quality of the components.

On my car (Karmann Ghia conversion) I started with 14 gauge cables, but these caused the effect I mentioned, tripping circuit breakers. At Home Depot I found a 50 foot 10 gauge extension cable, and it's been perfect. Cost a fair bit, but is worth it to know that the cable is not the weak link.

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Lionstrike
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Joined: 12/19/2011
Points: 74
Re: Extension Cords

Thanks for the responses all. I am going to go with that 10 foot 10 gauge wire on eBay that Anderson posted. I don't need much length on the extension cord, but 10 extra dollars for the right cable sure beats $1000 for a messed up charger.

It is probably an overstated problem but please bear with me, I have OCD.

PJD
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Joined: 11/22/2006
Points: 1243
Re: Extension Cords

A too low a capacity an extension cord absolutely, positively, cannot damage your charger. The only thing it can do is cause circuit breaker tripping of you are charging on a US style (120V) 15 amp circuit. A really long extension cord, in conjunction with a less inductive load can also prevent the circuit breaker from "seeing" a short circuit, should it occur, in the appliance at the end of the cord, possibly causing a fire. The extension cord warnings are largely just the lawyers talking. They suffer from a disorder in the USA called called litigiphobia.

antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1599
Re: Extension Cords

PJD wrote:

A too low a capacity an extension cord absolutely, positively, cannot damage your charger. The only thing it can do is cause circuit breaker tripping of you are charging on a US style (120V) 15 amp circuit.

There's actually a couple of design flaws in the Vectrix charger:

there's no input current limit, so it just tries to hold an output of 1500W

If the input voltage falls the current rises

If the current goes above ~19A continuous, the IGBT's on the input PFC stage burn out

A undersized extension cord increases the likelihood of this occurring

There is another fault where if the main internal 12v supply stops working for any reason, the startup supply takes the full load, burns out then applies 50v to the 12v rail....

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

Anderson
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 134
Re: Extension Cords

Because my house is wired with 14 gauge wire I found the nearest circuit breaker box to where I keep my Vectrix and the nearest AC outlet (must be directly wired to CBbox) to that circuit breaker box which was only 4' away. Then I ran my 50' 10 gauge extention cord from that Ac outlet to the Vectrix. Instead had I used the nearest AC outlet to plug the vectrix into using a 10' 10 gauge extention cord that would'nt have been as effective because there is about 60'of 14 gauge wire in the wall connecting that Ac outlet to the circuit breaker box that the electricity has to go through VS about 4' the other way.

I'am sorry If this is your case and you've already ordered the 10' E-Bay cord but better to find out now then never.

Make sure there are no high wattage (individual or cumulative) things being used that share the same circuit breaker when you plug in the Vectrix, note there are usually multiple AC outlets per circuit breaker.

If there isn't already put in a 20 amp circuit breaker in the circuit breaker box that the Vectrix uses.

One last thing in case your electrical outlet is back wired you should side wire it see; http://www.handymanhowto.com/2011/01/17/electrical-outlets-side-wire-versus-back-wire/
and maybe replace the outlet if it is old.

antiscab wrote:

There is another fault where if the main internal 12v supply stops working for any reason, the startup supply takes the full load, burns out then applies 50v to the 12v rail....

Matt

Has anybody developed a fix for this problem like a voltage limiter circuit for the startup supply yet ?

Lionstrike
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Joined: 12/19/2011
Points: 74
Re: Extension Cords

I don't actually have my choice of outlets. I just need a little room to keep it out of the rain.

antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1599
Re: Extension Cords

Anderson wrote:
antiscab wrote:

There is another fault where if the main internal 12v supply stops working for any reason, the startup supply takes the full load, burns out then applies 50v to the 12v rail....

Matt

Has anybody developed a fix for this problem like a voltage limiter circuit for the startup supply yet ?

the start up power supply is 11.5v, whereas the main powersupply is 12v

on one of the chargers a friend has repaired, he inserted a 15V zener on the 12v rail and replaced the startup powersupply with a small SMPS

the resulted in the charger never shutting down, but The Laird is having a go at fixing that issue in software

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

Anderson
Offline
Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 134
Re: Extension Cords

antiscab wrote:
Anderson wrote:
antiscab wrote:

There is another fault where if the main internal 12v supply stops working for any reason, the startup supply takes the full load, burns out then applies 50v to the 12v rail....

Matt

Has anybody developed a fix for this problem like a voltage limiter circuit for the startup supply yet ?

the start up power supply is 11.5v, whereas the main powersupply is 12v

on one of the chargers a friend has repaired, he inserted a 15V zener on the 12v rail and replaced the startup powersupply with a small SMPS

the resulted in the charger never shutting down, but The Laird is having a go at fixing that issue in software

Matt

Maybe a solution is using a battery so when the startup supply is energized that energizes a relay that connects a small 12 volt battery (about 20 amp hour) to the 12 volt rail eliminating the need for a startup supply and disconects it when the startup supply is denergized. This assumes that the startup supply stays on when the Vectrix's DC/DC Converter is on.

Note since the output of the startup supply will be disconected to the 12 volt rail it can't apply 50 volts to it and consequentely burn out so that problem is eliminated and the problem if the DC/DC Converter randomly fails the 12 volt battery will supply power long enough for you to be able to safely park the scooter off the road if need be.

I couldn't find out any information about the Vectrix DC/DC Converter but I think I found a comparable one the Meanwell SD-500H-12 ( http://www.meanwell.com/search/sd-500/default.htm ) that costs $499.

I think it would be better to get the Meanwell SD-1000H-12 ( http://www.meanwell.com/search/sd-1000/default.htm ) or whatever size converter is the next size larger than the stock Vectrix converter to be on the safe side. Another benifit is it might be powerful enough to not need a startup supply or 12 volt battery.

Another possibility is to keep the existing converter and make another converter to supply power to the fans, headlight and LED running lights that don't require as tightly regulated power as the the motor controler board ect. Note that converter will have to be issolated.

Frolle
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Joined: 05/11/2012
Points: 46
Re: Extension Cords

Look on Ebay, search for "12V 40A supply" and you find similar for only 75 USD.
I have bought similar for lead acid charging, and those I have got works well.
They are switched, and they most likely work fine with DC input as well.

Mik
Mik's picture
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Joined: 12/11/2007
Points: 3727
Re: Extension Cords

I bought one of these: 72/80/96/110VDC (56-154VDC) http://deutronic.com/fahrzeugwandler/75-watt-pot-getr_data_en.pdf but have not installed it yet.

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Anderson
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 134
Re: Extension Cords

I'd like to change a sentence from my previous post that has a wording error; "I think it would be better to get the Meanwell SD-1000H-12 ( http://www.meanwell.com/search/sd-
1000/default.htm ) or whatever size converter is the next size larger than the stock Vectrix converter to be on the safe side."

To; "I think it would be better to get a higher wattage DC/DC converter then the stock Vectrix converter to be on the safe side."

Also I'm not recomending getting the Meanwell SD-500H-12 converter.

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