Turn signal horn beeping

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Lionstrike
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Joined: 12/19/2011
Points: 74

Is there any way to disable the horn from beeping when the turn signal is left on too long? I've signaled for a turn before, and in the middle of a turn the horn does a repetitive beeping to let me know that the signals have been left on. It's SUPER annoying, and cars think that I am beeping at THEM. Anybody know how to turn that stuff off?

Thanks.

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LeftieBiker
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Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Find out if the beeping is generated by the flasher unit itself, and if so, replace the flasher unit with a standard, 'click-only' unit.

LeftieBiker
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Points: 654
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I have kind of the opposite problem. I like the beeping turn signals on my ZEV (how easily we forget those signals are on as we get older!) but they keep failing at an appalling rate, so I'm going to look for a quiet (clicks only) unit that will last thousands of miles instead of hundreds, or dozens...

MEroller
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Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Careful, Leftie, this is a Vectrix problem - the by eons most complex electric scooter on planet Earth - so complex even Vectrix themselves sometimes need a while to understand why things are happening...
It cannot be compared with our simple Chinese-based (I did not say assembled :-) electric rides.

Some genius software developer at some point in Vectrix development apparently thought it would be a great idea to help remind forgetful riders to turn off their turn signals by sending the blinking signal to the vehicle's horn also. How he determined after how many blinking cycles this should happen has probably been lost over the multiple bankrupcies...

My personal preference to get aorund this problem would be to only start blinking the turning lights when the turn becomes imminent, i.e. not leaving them on when standing in a queue at a traffic light waiting for the light to turn green, but only as I start going.

__________________

My (former...) ride: E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables, now wrecked

Domi422
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Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I have the same problem with these beeps. On my original french software they were not activated, and they came on when I installed The Laird's program. So I think it's a software issue.

__________________

Le site des utilisateurs français (The French user's website) http://www.vectrix.fr/

LeftieBiker
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Joined: 07/09/2011
Points: 654
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Dang, I try to avoid posting in the Complextrix topics, but it isn't always obvious to me that this is the case. I think a big, red, flashing "VECTRIX" icon should come on whenever someone posts about one. Maybe Bill Gates or someone can offer a Genius Grant to anyone who can completely fix all the design flaws in that bike....

X Vectrix
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Joined: 08/04/2009
Points: 235
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Do you turn off the directional when it starts beeping?

Aircon
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Joined: 12/23/2009
Points: 425
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I know it's software related, and the version I have starts the beeping after riding with indicators on for approx 10 seconds or so, but stops if I brake/regen and starts the 'countdown' again.

Also, this doesn't happen if I'm stationery.

antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1598
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I'm in the habit of resetting the indicator every 15 seconds or so

other options include disconnecting the horn - its something that I have never needed nor never will need....

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

Lionstrike
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Joined: 12/19/2011
Points: 74
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I've pretty much done the same thing... I time my signaling so that I don't beep people by accident.

I am glad to know that I am not the only one who this drives absolutely insane.

Aircon
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Joined: 12/23/2009
Points: 425
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

but the beep is only a very quiet beep, not the full sounding horn....at least on mine. in fact, over 40kph and I can't even hear it.

Galago
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

I too dislike the beeping horn per turn signal... another
thing I find even more annoying is that (at least on my bike)
the horn will stop beeping when the bike stops moving and
the turn signal is still on.
????
This tells me that it is indeed a software issue...and
that the software may not be able to keep track of how
many times the turn signal blinks ((you have GOT to
be kidding me!! was memory really that much more
expensive back then??)); although, the software does
know if the bike is moving so it turns on the horn.... ????

... I much prefer to just auto-cancel at 25 blinks.

antiscab
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Points: 1598
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Galago wrote:

... I much prefer to just auto-cancel at 25 blinks.

I know that part of the software is not in the charger, ironically it may be in the MC

I no longer have a charger at all (at least not a vectrix one)

If it's not in the MC, it may be in the ICM, in which case I remember a forum post some time back where someone had started to hack the ICM firmware

It may be yet something that can be fixed

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

X Vectrix
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Joined: 08/04/2009
Points: 235
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

The code is in the ICM, but it gets the speed info from the MC over CANbus. The delay is set for 20 seconds and is reset by any brake action or regen or if bike is not moving. Auto cancel can not be utilized b/c the directional switch is latched when activated. The ICM could turn off the blinker but if the your next attempt to signal is in the same direction the blinker would not come on!! (switch is still in the activated position so ICM does not recognize the new activation). Then you get T-boned.

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

X Vectrix wrote:

Then you get T-boned.

gee... isn't that alittle drastic?? I do like my bike....and can
appreciate ALL of the work that went into it to bring it to where it
is today..... in my garage (at the moment). ;-))

My father always used to tell me not to rely upon a blinker to turn a vehicle.
SIPDE, SIPDE, SIPDE ...

((Scan, Interpret, Predict, Decide, Execute))

Ride Safe - Ride Defensively - Ride to Live/Live to Ride.

X Vectrix wrote:

Auto cancel can not be utilized b/c the directional switch is latched when activated.

Is the mechanical latch a DOT requirement? ((versus momentary debounced in software))

X Vectrix
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Points: 235
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Galago wrote:

My father always used to tell me not to rely upon a blinker to turn a vehicle.
SIPDE, SIPDE, SIPDE ...

((Scan, Interpret, Predict, Decide, Execute))

Ride Safe - Ride Defensively - Ride to Live/Live to Ride.

As I tell my son everyday!! Don't rely on anything.

I suspect the latch is not DOT required, but most switch clusters are intended to be mechanical controls only (control the current directly not just create a signal to a processor) and need to be cancelled manually. The VX1 ICM samples the switch positions and then uses FETs to control all the lights.

MEroller
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Points: 650
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Most scooters and bikes these days have a momentary sliding switch for the blinker which always automatically returns to center detent, and in their center have a cancel button that you press to turn it off. I wonder more and more at what old fashioned hardware is still used in the VX1??? Even my first Aprilia scooter from 11 years ago had such a switch already...

__________________

My (former...) ride: E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables, now wrecked

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

X Vectrix wrote:

...(control the current directly not just create a signal to a processor)...
...
The VX1 ICM samples the switch positions and then uses FETs to control all the lights.

This seems to imply: 2 signals for ON - drop either for OFF.
(((high side mechanical switch, lamp/led, low side FET? (reduced circuitry for
high side fet gate biasing). MCU takes switch state then provides *_fet_gate_on (or not).)))

Is a buss used to drive the lamps? ...similar to a multiple 7-segment led display?
If so, which lamps?
tks!
mk

p.s. this is kind of off topic but: I have noticed that when driving at night, every time the bike
passes under a street light the display brightness changes intensity... is it just me or is it really
doing this???

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

antiscab wrote:

... it may be in the ICM, in which case I remember a forum post some time back where someone had started to hack the ICM firmware...

Matt

I seem to remember something along these lines also ... I did a search
and found it in this thread under the collaborative handbook:

Vectrix VX1 Tail light and break light issues and solutions

Mik wrote:

Here is some information I have been asked to post anonymously (slight edits done for anonymity):
...
"They are not like you normal bikes or cars where the switch controls the current flow, with the Vectrix the switch sends a signal to the ICM and the ICM then switches the circuit. So please be careful and keep this in mind when modifying things."
...

This issue at the time was tail lights becoming inoperative. Suspect was the headlamp due to loading
concerns on the 12vdc to the converter which drives the tail lamp(s)...surges et al.

...

X Vectrix wrote:

I suspect the latch is not DOT required, but most switch clusters are intended to be mechanical controls only (control the current directly not just create a signal to a processor) and need to be cancelled manually. The VX1 ICM samples the switch positions and then uses FETs to control all the lights.

...also

X Vectrix wrote:

The code is in the ICM, but it gets the speed info from the MC over CANbus. The delay is set for 20 seconds and is reset by any brake action or regen or if bike is not moving. Auto cancel can not be utilized b/c the directional switch is latched when activated. The ICM could turn off the blinker but if the your next attempt to signal is in the same direction the blinker would not come on!! (switch is still in the activated position so ICM does not recognize the new activation). ...

so...
IF (and that's a big if) I were to replace that switch with a momentary switch; AND, place the outputs from the
momentary switch into a lm555 timer trigger ((timer set to 20 secs or whatever I desire)); use the timer output to
control a relay, whose contacts would simulate the switching/latching portions of the old switch... I would then
have auto-cancelling turn signals..... eh?

...somehow I have a feeling it's not quite time to put a shrimp on the barbie...

Galago
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

make that a lm556 (one for each direction).....

Gedrod
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Joined: 09/23/2011
Points: 26
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

This annoys me too, however my other scooter (SYM HD 200) has a quite audible clicker that starts clicking as soon as I put the indicator on, like the one in a car. I prefer this. Has anyone installed a clicker on a Vectrix?
G

DoItYourself
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Points: 19
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

The Chirp is generated with a short impulse on the clacson driver.
It's generated from the ICM, i really like that reminder chirp (that's better than the Relais sound in the normal vehicles), i've readed all the posts in that thread and i dont' understand what's better for all of you,

do you will prefer a shorter chirp ?
no chirp?
chirp alwais active?

@MEroller .. the turn switch is the same for all the motorcycles.. also the Vx turn switch return in the center position and if you push it it cancel the turn position.

MEroller
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Re: Turn signal horn beeping

DoItYourself wrote:

@MEroller .. the turn switch is the same for all the motorcycles.. also the Vx turn switch return in the center position and if you push it it cancel the turn position.

Apart from the BMW GS650 from driving school days that drove me nuts with it's individual buttons on the left and the right side and a separate cancel button somwehere else. But thanks for the clarifcation concerning the VX1 hardware!

__________________

My (former...) ride: E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables, now wrecked

Aircon
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Joined: 12/23/2009
Points: 425
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

MErollerApart from the BMW GS650 from driving school days that drove me nuts with it's individual buttons on the left and the right side and a separate cancel button somwehere else. But thanks for the clarifcation concerning the VX1 hardware![/quote wrote:

BMW's idea is/was ridiculous and clumsy! I hope they're not still doing it like that.

israndy
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Re: Turn signal horn beeping

DoItYourself wrote:

i've readed all the posts in that thread and i dont' understand what's better for all of you,

do you will prefer a shorter chirp ?
no chirp?
chirp alwais active?

I agree, no one is talking alternatives. Since it cannot cancel after seeing me drive for a few seconds as I may still be in the turn, but I don't wanna be the old man driving for hours with the blinker on, having a reminder for times I don't hit cancel myself is a GOOD thing. All my old motorcycles had similar functions (manual cancel, clicky noise from blinker) except a fancy Honda that tried to auto cancel but on shallow turns left me blinking for hours, ugh.

-Randy

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

well, ... my Harley has auto-cancel. The blinker cancels after
about 20-25 blinks ((cant remember b'cuz it has been a couple of
years since last ridden)) ... the thing with this is that sometimes
is shuts off before I would prefer it to shut off; but, that is, by far,
less often than getting bothered by that stupid horn beeping on my Vx-1.
Maybe Antiscab is correct: just disconnect the horn - I never use it anyway.
With the timers added between the switch and the processor (as mentioned
above) one would still have to hit the cancel if the mechanical latch
portion was left intact. The time spent in a turn can be from a few
seconds to a minute or more (depending upon getting behind a non-turner
((right)) or waiting for a red light ((left))). So the functionality
really is best implemented in software/firmware ((motion sensing, et al.))
It does seem everyone has a unique riding preference and it might
be a good thing to have such functionality user selectable.... how THAT
would be implemented might best be addressed in another thread.

kevin smith
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Points: 446
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

i a word .............. IT SHOULD BE LEFT ALONE ............

WHY????????????? well i have been ridingmost of my life and if you have had a vectrix like me for over 4 years i dont belive that this tinny annoying little this as you think a reminder..........

to SAVE YOUR LIFE....... cos i have forgotten on many occations as the indicator light on the dash really should of been re designed and a much bigger used and also brighter used as well as led been used

and DAFFONALTLEY when my vectrix went away when been fitted for new software and new batterys the indicator should never of been changed from great time of TEN SECONDS TO A POOR 15 SECONDS which i didnt ask for and didnt want!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

.
so in short leave the indicator reminder well alone it will save your life or at least you will be saved of a very near miss so lets keep on biking

we love our v kevin

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

antiscab wrote:

I'm in the habit of resetting the indicator every 15 seconds or so....

soon you will find yourself using your left thumb trying to reset the steering wheel when driving
in your car..... keep the tv remote away from your left hand..... a nd when ty pin g soon you wi ll
d is co ver that you have extra sp aces in your text.....editing becomes a nightmare ...
that twitch, is called:

THE VECTRIX SYNDROME

martinwinlow
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Points: 202
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Isn't the timing or even the whole facility is configurable with the diagnostic software?

To those who 'never use the horn', how the hell do you signal to the gormless driver changing lanes that he is about to crush you against the car in the next lane (or whatever)?

MW

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Regards, Martin Winlow
Herts UK
evalbum.com/2092

MEroller
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Points: 650
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Yes, I was thinking similar thoughts of horror when someone wrote he never uses the horn... Using it to warn others to stay away from me has saved my day several times already!

__________________

My (former...) ride: E-Sprit Fury (basis is the ZAP/Erider Thunder 5000) since May 03, 2011. Mods: Battery temp. gauge and battery heating (off the grid and off the battery), Kelly KEB72801X, reverse activated, luggage rack with topcase, HC Cycle Analyst, Emsiso BMS2405, 35mm² battery cables, now wrecked

Galago
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Points: 119
Re: Turn signal horn beeping

Galago wrote:

SIPDE, SIPDE, SIPDE ...

((Scan, Interpret, Predict, Decide, Execute))

Ride Safe - Ride Defensively - Ride to Live/Live to Ride.

Everyone's circumstances are different and I suppose
if I had to ride into a daily commute environment where
I had to rely upon the bikes horn to keep me from being
"crushed" ... well... I just would not ride. That type
of environment, to me, is just too dangerous for motorcycles.
My experience riding motorcycles has taken me more
than 50K miles without accident.... never needed the
horn... on any bike I have ever ridden.... should the
circumstances ever change then I would look into
changing out that sorry excuse for a horn, that almost
all bikes have, with something that would actually
get someones attention.
Found the two connections to the horn are just push
on terminal lugs.... easy off.
Horns and helmets don't replace defensive driving
skills/strategies on motorcycles... but if your helmet
and horn make you feel secure then more power to ya...to each his own.

LET THOSE WHO RIDE DECIDE!

ride safe.
mk

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