The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

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R
R's picture
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Joined: 06/18/2009
Points: 1751
Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Wow, that hurts!
The picture:
can plug problem.jpg

the diagram:
Vectrix CAN serial lead_zpsihdufvtk.jpg~original.jpg

Here are the connection details for the PCAN-USB adapter shown on the peak-systems.com website:
Pin Pin assignment
1 Not connected / optional +5V
2 CAN-L
3 GND
4 Not connected
5 Not connected
6 GND
7 CAN-H
8 Not connected
9 Not connected / optional +5V

It seems that, yes, this pin IS used...

israndy
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I have had to deal with this over the years, although not recently as the 9 pin is pretty much a dead connector except for my two bikes. You can start by trying to bend it back, but metal will fatigue and snap. If you go slow there is a tiny chance it will bend back and be usable again.

Removing and replacing the connector will require taking out the two bolts that hold it in place. The connector will then fall back into the charging bay. If you take the windshield off and the cover below you might be able to reach it and solder on a new one. I don't remember what the other end of the connector is but if you can easily unplug it, you can do the solder work indoors, where putting a new connector on will be child's play compared to lining the connector back up to the hole in the glove box to bolt it down...

Painful, but no where near the end.

-Randy

__________________

Also a new 2013 Volvo C70 hardtop convertible, a 2000 Honda Hybrid Insight, and a 1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee
RVs: a 40' Airstream Sky Deck, a 23' LTV Serenity RV
EVs: a 2012 Mitsubishi i-Miev and two 2007 Vectrix VX1 motorcycles, and in line for the new Tesla Model 3

JimmyB
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

It might be OK without that pin since, afaik, the PCAN USB thingy gets its power from the USB side of things. Magic box would be different since, and prensel can verify, I think it gets its power from that +5v pin.

all imho and ymmv of course.

flexy
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Thanks for the advice guys. I did manage to bend it back and thankfully the programming seems to work.

I have flashed the Laird's files for motor controller and charger as per instructions, which must have worked as the fans start when the bike is switched on and remain on for 10 minutes following switching it off.

However I don't seem to get the voltage displayed on the dash when in riding mode (I do when charging) am I missing something?

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

If the software is loaded correctly, the voltage should appear in place of the "EST RANGE" in run mode.
It is still labelled as "Est Range", but you must have the display set to KM (not MILES) for the voltage to be viewed correctly:

The above picture indicates how a battery voltage of 137V is displayed on my NiMh Vectrix when switched between KM and MILES. The estimated range is no longer indicated, as it is definitely not 137 KM or 85 MILES, although I really wish it was!

Alan

flexy
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Oh, I see, that does make sense, I'm about to fit Leaf cells in mine and I want to get it right, the programming is more straight forward than expected. I'm looking forward to not have the fans running any more, silence is golden.

flexy
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I'm struggling to find any charger hex files for the lithium, are they still in development? or should I go for the software at http://www.vectrixsupport.com/ for a leaf cell conversion?

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

The two versions of The Laird's Leaf HEX files can be found here. One is for 18 Modules (36 Cells) and the other is for 19 Modules (38 Cells).

The Laird's HEX files are only suitable for the silver ESD charger.

If your Vectrix has the gold Runke(or EVPS) charger you will have to use the software from David Dugas (X-Vectrix) which is free to try for 25 power cycles without registering the software.

Alan

flexy
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Thanks Alan, mine's an ESD charger so this should work great.

boeingpilot
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Bikemad wrote:

The two versions of The Laird's Leaf HEX files can be found here. One is for 18 Modules (36 Cells) and the other is for 19 Modules (38 Cells).

The Laird's HEX files are only suitable for the silver ESD charger.

If your Vectrix has the gold Runke(or EVPS) charger you will have to use the software from David Dugas (X-Vectrix) which is free to try for 25 power cycles without registering the software.

Alan

I just did the conversion (18 Leaf cells). After going back and forth, decided to use David Dugas' software. It's more flexible, and since he was involved with the original design, I felt it was less of a 'hack' (no disrespect to the the Laird intended). The nice thing is you can define top and bottom voltage, assumed ah capacity. Also, David doesn't charge for it any more. I did purchase support from David and we chatted on the phone. Extremely nice guy. Also, should you charger die, you have more options (Runke, third party CAN bus enabled such as elcon)

Just my $.02

__________________

2009 Vectrix VX-1 Leaf Conversion
1983 Lambretta Lynx
1980 Vespa P200
2013 VW Jetta Hybrid

zeuz
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

flexy wrote:

I'm struggling to find any charger hex files for the lithium, are they still in development? or should I go for the software at http://www.vectrixsupport.com/ for a leaf cell conversion?

You also have the option of Vectrix Parts: http://service.vectrixparts.com/topics/4-vx-1-li-firmware-36s-li-ion-lithium-manganese-amita-nissan-leaf/

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

zeuz wrote:
flexy wrote:

I'm struggling to find any charger hex files for the lithium, are they still in development? or should I go for the software at http://www.vectrixsupport.com/ for a leaf cell conversion?

You also have the option of Vectrix Parts: http://service.vectrixparts.com/topics/4-vx-1-li-firmware-36s-li-ion-lithium-manganese-amita-nissan-leaf/

I don't think their software will be an option for Flexy:

Vectrixparts.com wrote:

Package of firmware for VX-1 equipped with our 36S Li-ion battery (Amita or Nissan Leaf based) - VX-1 Li-ion 36S Firmware package

Important - to be used only with EVPS (gold, Runke) Charger revision 1.9 or higher.
Important - to be used only with MP Tech Universal BMS System - configured for 36S

With the ESD charger it's basically a choice between The Laird's or X Vectrix.

Alan

Jim Logan
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Short version:
Thanks all.

Other comments:
I completed my Vectrix conversion to Li-ion last week. I bought the battery from hybridautocenter.com. I used a Zeva BMS that I acquired from antiscab, ready to install. I used the Laird's team files twice - First last year as I spent time repairing my NiMh pack, and then again when I switched to lithium-ion. Thanks all.

I found the maintenance manuals for the Vectrix on another web site. They came in real handy as I was figuring our which two were the right wires to connect going into the charger from the BMS relay. antiscab's videos of Vectrix assembly/disassembly were a big help and made it all seem possible.

I have most of of my old NiMh cells in a scrap battery barrel that will go to a battery recycler within a month. Let me know if someone has a better use for them. If someone reads this 2 years from now looking for some, I did hold back perhaps 25 of them (3 trays).

My Vectrix was a hand-me-down project from someone else I bought over a year ago. It's cool it just works now.

I have a 20 mile commute across mixed terrain, and after a week or so it looks in principle like it should be able to make 2 round-trips without recharging.

Thanks again all.

Jim Logan
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
USA

boeingpilot
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Jim Logan wrote:

Short version:
Thanks all.

Other comments:
I completed my Vectrix conversion to Li-ion last week. I bought the battery from hybridautocenter.com. I used a Zeva BMS that I acquired from antiscab, ready to install. I used the Laird's team files twice - First last year as I spent time repairing my NiMh pack, and then again when I switched to lithium-ion. Thanks all.

I found the maintenance manuals for the Vectrix on another web site. They came in real handy as I was figuring our which two were the right wires to connect going into the charger from the BMS relay. antiscab's videos of Vectrix assembly/disassembly were a big help and made it all seem possible.

I have most of of my old NiMh cells in a scrap battery barrel that will go to a battery recycler within a month. Let me know if someone has a better use for them. If someone reads this 2 years from now looking for some, I did hold back perhaps 25 of them (3 trays).

My Vectrix was a hand-me-down project from someone else I bought over a year ago. It's cool it just works now.

I have a 20 mile commute across mixed terrain, and after a week or so it looks in principle like it should be able to make 2 round-trips without recharging.

Thanks again all.

Jim Logan
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
USA

Excellent! I'm on the other side of the state with a Leaf conversion, but no BMS. I'd be interested to talk with you and see how you've wired the Zeva up.

Scott

__________________

2009 Vectrix VX-1 Leaf Conversion
1983 Lambretta Lynx
1980 Vespa P200
2013 VW Jetta Hybrid

Vicens
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Does the firmware with the name MC1022-a-ni.hex is compatible with my motor controller? This firmware is in the folder 80kmh. subfolder in Vectrix-files-selected/packs. I understand that this firmware limited to 80kmh. Limit of 80kmh is good for ni-mh batteries.

Is it a firmware Laird's? Do you have interesting options such as voltmeter, limitation of regenerative brake if the battery is charged, low voltage cut higher?

within a time change to lithium. I would like to not have problems with the battery, before making the change.

My bike had the firmware mc1021 and 4000.

I have installed the firmware charger 1000W and ICM2016rv42realCC.

R
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Good to see you here, vicens!

MC1022-a-ni

It is OEM Firmware from Vectrix. I'm sure it is the MC1021 you are running with some parameters changed to reduce battery stress, maybe it was build for fleets.

You may try it at your own risk. In case you try, please tell us if it works ok with the BC EVPS Rev 4000 for niquel.

Remember, always ask if you're not sure if you're uploading correct firmwares. Until now The laird files only use MC1014B and BC Files for ESD charger only.
If you send ESD file to EVPS charger, you will brick it!

Vicens
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I'm testing the firmware MC1022-a-ni.
It seems to work like the firmware mc1021. the speed limit is 83kmh.

BLUESTREAK
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

BUMP.

LithiumVectrix
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I have been a member of this forum for 5 years and have used the Laird's Li-Ion firmware for 8 conversions. All scooter firmware worked as described. Thank you to the Laird for all his work and testing, to write firmware so these scooters are suitable for Li-Ion batteries. I have used 3 different types of Li-Ion chemistries in these scooters and have found a suitable firmware choice for each one. I haven't been on this forum for some time and it is dissapointing to have to wade through all the insults and miss informed comments. These forums are still relevant and keep up the good work of sharing knowledge and experience.

Mel
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I have a problem which I need some help with. I had a problem with temp sensors, and decided to install the "no sensors" version of the charger firmware.

So I've just tried to re-flash the ESD charger in my VX-1 Nimh. I followed the detailed instructions to the letter, and all went well until I clicked the PROGRAM button to install the no temp sensor version of the Laird firmware into the charger. Then I got the message "Transfer Failed to VX1 Ni Vehicle Charger". As suggested I left the bike on, and restarted the laptop and ScooterDiag and retried. Same result. Ultimately had no choice but to shut things down.

Now when I turn on the bike all is fine, except solid red battery because its very low, and I get a GO, bike moves etc. However when I plug in and turn on the mains to charge I get no action at all from the charger. No fans, no lights, no dashboard indications. When I run scooterdiag both the charge and temperature panels are red, but otherwise no faults shown.

Anyone have any clue where I go from here? Help and useful advice would be appreciated.

Mel Clifford

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Blue VX-1, 2008.

VectrixLeaf
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

ups....maybe charger brick? I don not know...In program page Are all green or is charger in red? Other user sure will can help you.

Mel
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Charger and temp sensor panels are both red.

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Blue VX-1, 2008.

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Unplug the front and rear temperature sensor boards from the main harness and try to charge the battery.

My faulty temperature boards prevented the canbus from communicating with the charger:

With both of the temperature boards disconnected, the charger status started working again:

I was then able to charge the bike (accompanied by the flashing battery light and temperature light) and also install The Laird's firmware:

Alan

Mel
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Thanks Alan,

Did as you suggested and the firmware change went smoothly. Now charging nicely with the "no-sensor" version of the charger firmware. If I use the old scooterdiag I can see that one whole set of sensors are showing 60c, whilst the other set are giving sensible readings. Somewhat worried at the non-uniform cell temp increase - looks like I've missed a duff cell in there, unless its just that the middle layer cells heat more than the outer layers. I think now that I know everything else is working I'll buy a front-sensor board from vectrix parts and install this.

Can anyone confirm that in the version 1 diags the front sensors are the ones shown at the top of the list of sensors?

Cheers

Mel

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Blue VX-1, 2008.

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Hi Mel, it's good to hear your charger is working properly again.

If you compare the pre charge temperatures with the post charge temperatures, you can see exactly how much each group of cells has changed.
(I took screen shots before and after to collect the data.)

The following table shows the calculated temperature rise between the before and after charge temperatures for each temperature sensor on my red Vectrix:

The graph on the right clearly shows the reduced temperature rise as a direct result of installing The Laird's firmware with a maximum 6A charging current compared to a previous charge using the original Vectrix firmware.

My 10 year old battery no longer overheats during the charge process, which it previously started to do on a regular basis with the original Vectrix firmware.

Mel wrote:

Can anyone confirm that in the version 1 diags the front sensors are the ones shown at the top of the list of sensors?

Cool air is drawn in the front, which slowly warms up as it passes through the front and rear battery before exiting at the rear, therefore it seems logical to me that the rear ambient sensor module will register a higher temperature rise than the front (exactly double in my case). So I am pretty sure that the front pack houses the 1-6 "4D" modules and the rear pack houses the 1-6 "4E" modules, therefore the front sensors are likely be the ones shown at the top of the list on both versions of the diagnostic software.

When you next have your battery apart, carefully inspect the temperature sensors for signs of corrosion, as this is what I found on one of the temperature sensor modules on my blue Vectrix, after I disconnected both of the temperature sensor boards to get the charger working again:

I think the corrosion/oxidisation (combined with moisture from condensation etc.) allowed high voltage from the battery cell terminal to track across the small isolation gaps on the circuit board:

This high voltage would then travel up the sensor wires straight to the temperature board, which subsequently fails, and this board failure prevents the charger (and CANBUS communication) from working properly.
I have left both temperature boards disconnected on my blue Vectrix and (nearly 18 months later) it is still charging nicely with The Laird's (No temperature sensor) firmware installed.

Alan

Vicens
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I can not access the box from the link.

error. File or folder is deleted.

If you share the link from whasapp. Yes that works for me. Only from the shared device.

Vicens
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

Duplicate.

Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I can't access it either:

And I don't have Whatsapp.

Alan

Sacko
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1
Bikemad
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Re: The Laird's Team Files for the VX1

I don't think that I currently need any files, but this thread is not much use to new members if the link no longer works.

Although, it would be nice to also see what updates were available, just in case I wanted to upgrade to newer firmware again.

Alan

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