e fun scooters
I have 2 of the e fun scooters a 2000w(C) and a 3000w(D) in canada.I received them 3 months ago and have put about 1000 test kms. on them. They have lead batteries and the big one is heavy! It will hit 80 kms /hr. on a long flat stretch and pulls pretty well from a standstill. It will keep up with normal traffic. The suspension needs attention and I believe that they are addressing the issue. Also the frame is too light duty for the weight of the batteries and rider. It has never had the range that it is suppose to ,but in fairness I think I have a problem battery but I haven't checked it out yet. The finish on the D is a little rough but its still a prototype so I'm sure when they start building a lot of them it will improve. The C model is more refined, smaller, lighter and frankly more enjoyable to ride. Top speed is 60 km/h in high range. I relocated the speed range switch which makes it alot more convenient to shift. The scooter chassis is the same as a TNG Milano gas scooter which I have one of, so it feels very familiar to ride. Its very maneuverable and light feeling even with the lead/acid batteries. I imagine that the D model would be better with lithium ion batteries, although the C model with more power would suit me even better. I'm not much of a computer guy but if I can figure out how to do it I will post some photos.
Thanks Dave for posting about these scooters. I look forward to the pictures. Do you have further specifications about the bikes (controller settings, battery size/type, battery charger ratings, etc.) than what is posted on the efun website? For the 2000W model's shifter, is it mechanical like on the XM-2000's setup (solenoid on hub) or just something different that happens in the controller? Also does the 3000W model have a similar shifter setup or not? As far as the range on the 3000W about how far can you go on a charge?
Thank you for the encouragement. The C model seems to have similar specs to your xm -2000.I rode the C (and the D)home from work a couple of times and I live in a fairly rural area and was traveling on roads with 80 km/h (50mph) speed limit and a distance of 37 kms. (21 miles)on hilly roads. I rode both of them flat out the whole way, leaning down when necessary, mostly on uphills to try and keep the speed up and of course on downhills because its fun. The C model would fade to about 40 km/h on a couple of the long hills but would go 80 km/h down the other side. The D model would slow to about 55 km/h and go over 100 on the downhills! The C made it the whole way in high speed mode, while the D model would go into a "protective" low speed mode not allowing it to exceed about 50 km/h after about 30 kms. I think that it has a battery problem though. I have to check it out when I get some time. dave
I don't know about controller settings, the battery type/size is.... big and heavy and the battery charge rate is...slow. I'm just kidding. I know the batteries in the D are 5x50ah and the C has 5x35ah, the charger for the C is 3.5amps and the D is 5.The D doesn't have a high /low range but it goes good from a standing start, much quicker off the line than the C. thanks, dave
wheel easy dave,
Where in Canada did you purchase them?
He imported them from the manufacturer.
For battery charging: info I have says 7.5 amps for efun-d VRLA and 10 amps for li-ion. I have a chart on my web site for lion.
DanCar,
Thanks, that's Mountain's company, correct?
Are you also a dealer?
Verna,
No, this is not Mountains company!
Also, specs for the bike have changed a bit since Dave in Canada imported his two bikes & it is up to the importer to decide what specs are suitable for their particular market.. Motor size, batteries, controller amp, etc.. So there is perhaps not just one answer to what are the specs for these bikes.
The bikes I have for my market (Australia) are different to the ones Dave has.
Ben
Ben,
How do your bike's specs compare to Dave's? Can you remind which models you have?
Vinnie,
I have:
Efun-a with 2000w motor and slightly more amps than Daves Efun-c.
Efun-c with 3000w motor but in high torque windings setup.. Less top speed than Daves Efun-d. Both running same max amps. This one obviously has more performance than Daves Efun-c setup with his 2000w motor which would be similar to my Efun-a.
Efun-d with 3000w motor but more max amps than Daves. Should have better top speed, acceleration and better hill climbing ability.
Not dissimilar to the way car manufactures sell the same model around the world with different motors and specs. You have to choose what is right for your market.
Ben
Ben,
What batteries are you using? How close are you to beginning retail sales?
Thanks (and good luck)
John,
I am still complying my bikes here in Australia. So still a couple of months off. It is a very expensive and time consuming process.
My bikes have: Efun-a BB 35ah. Efun-C BB 35ah. Efun-D BB 50ah. Lithium still being investigated to find a good cost performance option. I have seen some test results and they are not bad at all. Of course we always want more don't we..
As an aside.. I am about to start testing the BatteryEQ system for these bikes too. If it tests favorably, I will at least offer it as a highly recommended option or maybe just include it and bump the price up to cover the cost.
Ben
Ben,
Rather than offering the BattEQ - I'd suggest you consider offering a bank charger rather than a string charger. See if your Chinese contacts can source a decent one - or make one from five 12V 2A chargers.
Just a thought.
Tracy, the XM-2000 equivalent would be the EFUN-B not EFUN-C.
I have been watching the info on the bank charging v string charging with balancers (batteryEQ or powercheq) keenly. I really do want to try and avoid a bad experience for customers by providing the best possible product for the price point. These really should be every bit as good and practical as a similar IC scooter. That is the goal anyway.
Ben
Ben,
Why not do a side by side comparison? You seem to be quite heavily invested in getting EFun to the Australian market - so why not rig up one scoot with balancers and string charger and one with bank chargers and no balancers?
I very much agree with your goal. In fact ultimately the EV scoot should be better than the gas scoot - especially as with scooters the maximum range is less of an issue (most folks don't ride a scooter very far - they're the ultimate short/medium distance commuter vehicle). In other words the gas scoot will most likely always be able to go farther but we're real close to the E-scoot going "far enough". Now, if the batteries would last three years instead of three months that would be great! The EV should have less maintenance issues and be easier to own and operate. Give it another couple of years and there should be thousands of these on the roads...
(hey, a boy can dream, right? ;-) )
Ben,
I have a set of PowerCheqs on one of my e-bikes and I have had a very bad experience with them which I think needs to be addressed. I left the PowerCheqs on the battery pack over the winter and they discharged my batteries to almost nothing. This of course caused me to have to buy a new set of batteries. The ruined set was only 4 months old with 187 cycles on and going strong, now they are door stops. I think the instructions need a large warning this will happen or they need a cutoff voltage to prevent this.
My 2 Watts Worth,
Chas S.
That is a very nice and clear demonstration of the advantages of bank charging. I had it in the back of my head that individually charging the batteries would sort the charging problem at least.
I can see that balancers would as you say make some sense on a commute to work. Commute home.. No charge at work. But as you point out the balancers need to be started further in the discharge cycle. Not constantly on and working or as you point out, during charging, further burdening the weakest battery. But for only a limited use, the cost/benefit is severely diminished.
Now... to search for an economical bank charging solution.
I found several multi chargers here. I am not sure if these are what you are looking for but I found them about a year ago when doing research on which way to go, balancers or bank charging.
I went with the PowerCheqs but found them to have some draw backs. The always "on" properties of the PowerCheqs can damage batteries, I lost a good set of batteries to the PowerCheqs. The always "on" also causes chargers to continue charging when they should have shut down. This also damages a set of used but good batteries. These were the only negatives I found.
They do help increase range as well as keeping the current flow high longer during discharge. I could hold higher speeds with more power for hill climbing deeper into a ride. I think for discharge the PowerCheqs are great but you do need to disconnect them when the batteries are not in use, or during charge.
The best of both worlds is to charge with a bank charger bringing each battery to it's best potential, then after you ride say a mile or two turn on the PowerCheqs to balance the pack during the ride. Too much trouble and cost for me.
I do have the PowerCheqs and plan to get a bank charger so all I really have to do is find a switch that can switch the PowerCheqs on and off all together. I don't like using relays because they drain power that could be used by the motor.
Chas S.
usatracy,
Thanks for the advice on the Vector Chargers. Do you have a model number or a link to the units you are using?
Chas S.
Thanks Dave - I look forward to seeing some pics. If you're going to be an importer then it's probably worth your while to invest in a PakTrakr with data acquisition capability for both bikes. That, combined with a GPS will give you a pretty good independent testing capability. If you post hard data to this site you'll get all the analysis you could want for free (of course it'll be up to you to determine the value of that analysis!).
BTW, if you do want to go the data acq route - then consider getting an iQue3600 used on ebay and I can give you software to combine the iQ data with the PakTrakr data. Send me a message (via the Write to Author link) if this is of any interest to you.
Thanks again - don't be put off if this thread starts a LOT of discussion. That's a good thing... ;-)