80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

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ruprek
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I have a 1500 watt BMC 48 volt 3-phase brushless motor which I have had for about a year and a half. I couldn't be happier with the motor, but I'm cooking controllers out here in the deserts of Arizona. I have had the brushless controllers (4) which are rated stock at 55 amps modified to 70,80,90 and 100 amps, with varied degrees of success. However, the heat thats being generated is turning my controllers into solder meltdowns. I have added fans, which have helped, but I need to know who makes a 3-phase brushless controller that would match up to the motor I have. Incidentally, I purchased the Motor from Powerpack motors. Thanks for your input.

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antiscab
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Hi ruprek,

try kelly controllers,
their largest one will do 200A for a mintue, 100A continuous.
they do smaller ones aswell, but by the sounds of things, u need something beefy.
http://www.kellycontroller.com/mot/Ebike-BLDC-controller.html

Matt

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andrew
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Maybe you could try putting 4110 mosfets in? Just a thought.

iconoclast
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Can you tell us more about what exactly is melting (where on the board). Better yet, can you post photos of the blown controller boards?

You mention power mods to these boards - what exactly did you upgrade?

What is the ambient temperature these are failing in? What kind of load - weight and inclines?

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ruprek
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Ok, I'll do my best to describe in laymen's terms because electrical engineering isn't my forte. Additionally, I may be looking for another controller as I sent all four of my controllers to a guy named Bob Mcree in Oregon, who initally seemed to be the guy I needed to mod the controllers. Long story short, I paid him for two controllers and now I am unable to reach him and my calls and emails go unanswered. Although in fairness he did send one of the modified controllers, but it didn't workfrom which he did send one to me. I couldn't get it to work so I sent back. Mistake! He was supposed to repair the one he sent on warranty, but that was 4 month's ago. But since the possiblity of getting my controllers back appears bleak, your questions asked may be mute. But since you asked...
The smaller mosfets burned at built up solder along the circuit board 3 times and one of the mosfets actually cracked in two. The solder was built up to increase the amperage up from the 55 amp so that they were ranging from 55-100 amps.The ambient temperature was varied. The average would have been around 90 degrees. Only one of them cooked when I was going flat out in about 110 degrees trying to catch someone in a car. The rest of them seemed to really get hot when I was putting around in very small hills and in grass. My gearing was a little tall, but the motor had fairly quick acceleration off the line. I' am 180 lbs, but I don't know what the scotter weighted, but the last controller had 4 ah 22's to push around on stock tires. I had photos but computer crashed and I lost photos.
Anyhow, I looked up Kelly controllers and got excited. They appear to be a quality product at a reasonable price. Can anybody give me a testimonial on these controllers? Would I need to buy one of the throttles they sell or would my heavier duty after market Hall throttle work? I appreciate all your answers appreciate it. And if anybody knows Bob, tell him Johnny Law is looking for him. No pun intended.

ruprek
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Anybody familiar with Kelly controllers? I'm getting ready to plunk down 3 bills on one of the brushless models and I was hoping I would get a little feedback on what to expect??

iconoclast
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Sorry to hear you lost your controllers.

I haven't used the Kelly controller but was looking at them myself. Would love to hear about your experience if you buy one. I'll do the same if I get to it first. I am modding a spare controller myself at the moment, will let you know how well it works.

Chris

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andys
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

A friend of mine is running the Kelly 150 amp one with the same motor you have. he had some trouble figuring out all the phase wires, but it runs great now and the controller doesn't get hot at all. Its nice that you can hook that controller up to a PC and change a lot of parameters to customize the way it works.

LinkOfHyrule
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

ruprek wrote:

The smaller mosfets burned at built up solder along the circuit board 3 times and one of the mosfets actually cracked in two. The solder was built up to increase the amperage up from the 55 amp so that they were ranging from 55-100 amps.The ambient temperature was varied. The average would have been around 90 degrees. Only one of them cooked when I was going flat out in about 110 degrees trying to catch someone in a car. The rest of them seemed to really get hot when I was putting around in very small hills and in grass. My gearing was a little tall, but the motor had fairly quick acceleration off the line. I' am 180 lbs, but I don't know what the scotter weighted, but the last controller had 4 ah 22's to push around on stock tires. I had photos but computer crashed and I lost photos.

So, if I'm hearing this right, you beefed up the power traces, but not the MOSFETs? If that's the case, replace them with something beefy. 4110s are pretty much the best you can get.

Bob McCree, huh? He's got an account here. He's over on Endless-Sphere, too. I'd PM him to see what the deal was.

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ruprek
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Thanks for all the input. I spoke to Tim At Powerpackmotors and he felt the Kelly would be a potential good controller for this motor. He explained to me that there might be one potential problem in getting everything out of the motor. I'll take the liberty of quoting him as he really knows his stuff and anything I might paraphrase could paint the picture completely different. Tim said about the Kelly 150,"The Kelly manual specifies that it's good only up to 60,000 electricaly rpm, which you then have to divide by the number of poles on the motor's rotor to get mechanical rpm. The result is 3750 rpm. That should mean that the Kelly will malfunction in some way when the 1500 is run at full throttle, at least in a no load test(free running). Motor rpms are about 90/volt, which would be 4500 rpm free running at 50v. The controller has speed settings(it's programable as you probably know) so it may be that the guy(deleted is his name) has the speed set low enough that the rpm limit isn't violated, or it may simply be that the rpms stay low enough under load to be OK. I think the controller either allows the throttle to be limited or the rpms to be limited. If that's the case then there's built-in protection." I haven't responded to Tim yet, But I think I get the gist of his point. If any of you have an answer to the possible question Tim raised, please comment.I think I'm going order the Kelly 150 and see if what it can do.
And for anyone who can get a hold of Bob Mckee, let him know no hard feelings if he can get my controllers back. I hope he's ok. It just sucks having to ride my wifes scooter which is sloooow compared to my Rocket. The difference the Brushless 1500 makes is profound. When it's running, I feel like a kid again and actually dream about it. It's pretty goofy, but that 1500 motor is really quite remarkable.

LinkOfHyrule
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

EV blingage: The best kind of bling. ;)

I could have sworn there was another step to that 60,000 electric RPM thing. Something involving a six...eh, can't remember.

The problem with the motor going to fast is the MCU isn't able to keep up, and makes the signal to the FET gate drivers get all wonky. If it's really bad, then you could even end up getting shoot-through (two phases being on at the same time), which will kill the FETs pretty much instantly. I'd be careful, if I were you...

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Tireiron55
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

That looks like a Stealth. I would love a 1500w Brushless motor for my Stealth.

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ruprek
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

I guess if you painted it black, removed the front disk brake(06 model) and switched I-zip for Schwinn stickers it would be a stealth. I personally don't know why the I-zip was almost $100 than that years Stealth except for the front disk brake. And I just had to have the front disk. The motor mount was the only thing that took time to make. And I just got lucky cause it lines up fairly straight and a taller shock gives the motor enough room for travel.
I'll check on the the fet killers from Kelly. Tim had mentioned another person who was using the 150 Kelly and was only getting 30 mph out of it with the brushless. That concerns me as I was getting 39 mph out of modified Powerpack controllers. I won't ever be happy at 30 after becoming one of the anointed scoots that can pretty much keep up with traffic at 39 mph. Theres something amiss cause there's no way I should be getting 25% more speed than the friend of Tims, I am not that good, just ask my wife.
And one other shout out. Bob M. was adding the big fets for me. We were trying to come up with a way to keep the temperature down when he went awol on me.
battery_bay_and_controller_housing_017.jpg

ruprek
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

You would think there would be built in protection of over reving the controller. I'm assuming that would be addressed via the programming features on the controller. Yes??

LinkOfHyrule
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Re: 80 - 100 amp 3-phase brushless controller

Probably. If you wanna try it, there might be a visible clock oscillator for the CPU. Replacing it with a faster resonator would overclock the CPU and give you a higher RPM limit. Works for the e-crazyman controllers, anyway.

See sig. ;)

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