Vectrix acceleration testing

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Mik
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Has anyone else done objective acceleration tests with their Vectrix?

In some other threads some riders keep mentioning how great the acceleration is and how it outruns cars at traffic lights etc.

Either their Vectrix accelerates better than both the ones I have tested, or the car drivers in their area are more sedate than here.

In my experience, the acceleration off the line is clearly insufficient to outrun any modern middle-class car at the lights in the first 20-30 meters, where it counts.

Once above 45km/h the acceleration is sufficient for accelerating out of trouble, and very good between 60km/h and 85km/h. Great fun on uphill, winding mountain roads!

But it sucks off the line in my experience, especially uphill.

So how about a few others do some semi-objective testing?

Almost everyone with a Vetrix would have access to a MP3-recorder, I guess.

Tape it inside your helmet or close to your throat, turn it on, count "Ready, Set, Go", open the throttle fully and then call out 10, 20, 30 etc to 80km/h or higher when you reach those speeds.

The listen to it at home with a stop-watch and let us know what results you get.

The results could tell us how much payload and/or individual scooter characteristics influence the acceleration.

In my experience the claimed 6.8s from 0-80km/h is unrealistic.

Between 9.5s and 12s is much closer to the truth in my experience! (with 112kg payload).

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rgx
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

I guess the simple explanation is that most drivers drive very slowly from traffic lights. In theory even a modest family car can do 0-100 (km/h) in about 10 s, but you know how it's done? a) rev the engine to about 4000 rpm b) wait for the traffic light to turn yellow c) hammer the throttle and at the same time meet with clutch for a perfect take-off, including some wheel spin the first meters d) change gears to 2nd and 3rd without lifting the throttle, or perhaps only for a fraction of a second. Anything less than that and you will be looking at perhaps 12-14 s. Most people have never done it. Many don't even know how to.

So in reality you seldom see people doing that. Over here people take perhaps 15 s to reach 70 km/h. Changing gears take them several seconds. And its always the slowest driver who sets the pace, unless you happen to be first in line. I am also driving a Honda Civic Hybrid with a CVT, and normally hold a steady 2000 rpm when accelerating from a red light - unless I'm first. 3000 rpm is often enough to accelerate away from the crowd. (That translates to about 50 hp being used. Car weighs 1300 kg.) Maybe I should add also that over here, most cars are manual.

At the same time, this is the beauty of the Vectrix. You can accelerate hard effortlessly and without noise. I don't share the experience that it's slow off the line, like some others report. As for all EVs, torque is limited at low speed, and power at high. I think the transition is around 40-50 km/h for the Vectrix. To some users this might appear as sluggishness below 40 km/h.

I have been planning for a long time to rig up a G-tech to measure acceleration, will keep you posted.

moccasin
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

I would rate my accelleration as "Very Nice". And for me, is typically way more accelleration than I am allowed to use because of traffic in front of me.

However, there's no way to compare computer controlled accelleration to "popping a clutch" for a jackrabbit take-off. It just ain't gonna happen. Contrary to ICE machines, electric engines require a progressive and smooth take off, and Vectrix has done a great job of creating just that with their controller.

I have read many times on the NMG boards where drivers have spun out, broken belts and even sheared off the drive pullies of the Sparrows and NMGs by being too heavy footed on take offs (those vehicles are no where near the technical advancements of the Vectrix).

I have no problem reaching 60mph in under seven seconds on a flat take off with no one in front of me, but at the same time, I have no real need for that kind of performance from a commuter vehicle.

Wotnopetrol
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

I wondered why the Vectrix was slowish and heavily controlled from a standstill until the other night on the way home.
It was raining and I opened the throttle to full from the traffic lights.

Within a few yards I ran over a metal manhole cover and the back wheel raced away with the back end fish-tailing.

I think because of the incredible torque of electric motors they had to control the low speed acceleration, otherwise you'd have less experienced riders, and maybe some experienced ones, ending up on the road, wondering who removed the bike from under them.

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Mik
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

moccasin wrote:

I have no problem reaching 60mph in under seven seconds on a flat take off with no one in front of me, but ...

Measure it before making claims like that! You are even topping the Vectrix hype with that claim.

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Hands0n
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

As a rider/owner of ICE machines (Honda 1992 Fireblade, Honda '99 X11 (naked Blackbird) and KTM LC640 Supermoto) I have to say that the Vectrix acceleration from standstill is acceptably grin-inducing!

A few years back I had a Gilera Runner 180 - that was a nifty little machine with an indicated top speed of 95mph. It was, in its day, rated as the quickest scooter around. I would say that was accurate. But now, with the Vectrix, I find that it is no slouch and I have yet to have an ICE scooter take the lead away from the lights. Once around 30mph there is a general catching up and once the Vectrix's limits are met (not in town) it is then left behind in the dust of others.

As for cars, unless there is a very determined effort by the driver I find, as others on here do, that the average car driver limps off from the lights allowing the Vectrix to gain a head start without any effort at all. Rarely have I had to "give it some" with a car - there was one BMW driver recently but he doesn't count (he nearly stacked it into the back of an articulated lorry for not looking where he was going!).

The Vectrix is not the quickest thing on two wheels, but it does have that certain "shove" that gets going along quite nicely.

moccasin
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Mik wrote:

Measure it before making claims like that! You are even topping the Vectrix hype with that claim.

I did, but maybe I'm just a fast counter. Perhaps I'll try it again with a watch. ;-)

Hermes
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

"But it sucks off the line in my experience, especially uphill"

I wouldn't say it sucks.

I can only compare it to my previous Vespa 200cc. Admitedly the Vespa was definitely quicker off from stand still but the Vectrix's accelleration is smoother. You can go from 30 to 50 miles very quickly. My Vespa would lose momentum after 30 and though it could reach 70mph it took it a longer while .
So if I had to race with a scooter up to 250cc they'd speed off ahead for the first 3 seconds then I'd over take them.
Anything over 250cc they'd definitely upstage me.
Does it make sense?

X

PS I found that twisting the throttle fully for 1 second, letting it snap back to neutral and then twisting again the accelleration improves from just twisting the throttle and keeping it twisted until desired speed is reached.

Mik
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Hermes wrote:

"But it sucks off the line in my experience, especially uphill"

I wouldn't say it sucks.

I can only compare it to my previous Vespa 200cc. Admitedly the Vespa was definitely quicker off from stand still but the Vectrix's accelleration is smoother.

I rest my case!

Quote:

PS I found that twisting the throttle fully for 1 second, letting it snap back to neutral and then twisting again the accelleration improves from just twisting the throttle and keeping it twisted until desired speed is reached.

That's interesting, does anyone else find this? My Vectux is still in pieces, I'll try it out as soon as I can.

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undead
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Mik wrote:
Hermes wrote:

"But it sucks off the line in my experience, especially uphill"

I wouldn't say it sucks.

I can only compare it to my previous Vespa 200cc. Admitedly the Vespa was definitely quicker off from stand still but the Vectrix's accelleration is smoother.

I rest my case!

Quote:

PS I found that twisting the throttle fully for 1 second, letting it snap back to neutral and then twisting again the accelleration improves from just twisting the throttle and keeping it twisted until desired speed is reached.

That's interesting, does anyone else find this? My Vectux is still in pieces, I'll try it out as soon as I can.

I will try it on mine tomrrow

marcus
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

w/a big controller, ask the mfg if you can control
the ramp-up, but you won't the same mpc (milespercharg), maybe half?

PT-Volt
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Mik wrote:

Has anyone else done objective acceleration tests with their Vectrix?

Hi.

You can see my first acceleration in the beginning (30/40 seconds) of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vh-8pLU6ayo

The battery was not full but the bike still kept some power :).

Mik
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

PT-Volt wrote:
Mik wrote:

Has anyone else done objective acceleration tests with their Vectrix?

Hi.

You can see my first acceleration in the beginning (30/40 seconds) of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vh-8pLU6ayo

The battery was not full but the bike still kept some power :).

Thanks for that!

Your Vectrix seems very quiet compared to mine, but that could be related to the recording technique.

The acceleration is very similar to mine, just a fraction faster with 8.8s from 0-80km/h.

Did you have less than 110kg on board on that trip?

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PT-Volt
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Well, I weight 90kg (before dinner) :-).

jdh2550_1
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

Hi,

As part of our research for our "super secret" new bike we hope to launch next year we rode a Vectrix with GPS logging (courtesy of MaryT - thanks Mary!). We would have added voltage and amperage data acquisition but the V is much better "buttoned down" than the XM and we didn't want to dismantle MaryT's new baby.

I didn't specifically do a zero to Vmax drag run - but I did do a couple of maximum acceleration from the lights sort of ride. From my quick look at the data I think the best I got was 0-74kph in 8 seconds. (And yes, I did LOVE the bike - I even kind of liked the regen on throttle arrangement).

Here's a couple of graphs (unfortunately 500x500 are the max dimensions allowed by this forum):
vectrix-all-data.png

vectrix-0-to-45.png

If anyone wants the full data file as an XLS (or CSV if you prefer) drop me a line.

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Mik
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

jdh wrote:

I didn't specifically do a zero to Vmax drag run - but I did do a couple of maximum acceleration from the lights sort of ride. From my quick look at the data I think the best I got was 0-74kph in 8 seconds.

Thanks for that graph, excellent data!

(After downloading and enlarging) the graph shows clearly that the acceleration is electronically limited until about 40km/h is reached. Then it starts to take off nicely, shown by the increased steepness of the curve.

Above 40km/h the curve also shows the "rounding off" of an inverse exponential function that is to be expected due to E=1/2mV² .

Acceleration from zero to 75km/h is shown to take 8.4s with an 80kg rider, very consistent with my experience.

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pointman39
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Re: Vectrix acceleration testing

For me I trashed my Vectrix, since it only worked part of the time, a real Junker of a bike! Once I got my rear wheel slid across a small patch of wet leaves, only to find the bike spin out of control and the next thing I know the bike is on top of me; luckily I was all right! Looking over the financial aspects of the Vectrix company online, it is a public company so all information about their $$ is available, they seem to waste a lot of cash, and none has to do with improving their bike. They are bringing out a Chinese made bike in 2009 and slapping it with a Vectrix logo, just to sell something cheap!! For me Vectrix was the first out of the gate in this race for an all electric 2 wheeler, but my bet is someone else will beat them, and beat them badly!

Anyone heard about the company EVC USA? I heard they held up production, only because they have made some dramatic changes to their motorcycles, and for the better I am told, so they will be out sometime in mid 2009. Can anyone validate this?

In conclusion, Vectrix nice try, but I will pass!

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