Maximum kilometres or miles

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antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1585
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

the lower indicated range would mean the measured capacity of your pack on your latest BalPor, is lower than on your previous.

aside from damage, things that will cause lower capacity:
self discharge (its been sitting around for 12hrs+ since last full charge)
temperature (moves the self discharge "knee" deeper into the packs capacity, and accelerates self discharge at all points)
dodgy connection (corrosion)

it is actaully better to perform BalPor after the bike has been sitting around long enough for self discharge to have reached its knee (as in its slowed down), as this will be your worst case minimum capacity.
ergo, even with self discharge, you shouldnt ever experience disappearing bars
if you do have a true full pack, you have some reserve after all your bars have been consumed naturally.

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

turok
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Joined: 03/11/2009
Points: 326
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

Thanks Matt,

well, I went for a little longer ride than my usual ones (16 km instead of the usual 3-4 despite of freezing temperatures:-)) and the bars went away at normal speed and after about 6 km, It began to climb again to a reasonable number: I've done 30 km and have an exp. range of 28. Normal to me.
I begin to suspect the low temperatures: as the pack heated up a bit, the range went up quickly (?)
Or a dodgy connection indeed(?)
but the performance is flawless otherwise..

I' not worried any more at the time..

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jurba
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Joined: 03/12/2009
Points: 97
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

16.000 today

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RaDy
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Joined: 07/16/2008
Points: 327
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

cool, 16.000kms already with the first Batt pack, its sounding more convincing to make it to 30.000kms!

jurba
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Joined: 03/12/2009
Points: 97
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

between 1300 and 1600 km a month ...

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R
R's picture
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Joined: 06/18/2009
Points: 1381
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

20.100 km.
If the battery keeps on performing nicely, I'm not sure if I'll immediately install the lithium upgrade... it will depend on the price... and on the feeling that discarding a fully operational battery it is not ecological at all...

SANY0112 ok (Medium).JPG

antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1585
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

agreed, im not even ordering my replacement pack until m current one is dead.

i got burnt last time that happened, i ordered cells ahead of time, and by the time i needed them, there were far better cheaper ones around.

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

Mik
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Joined: 12/11/2007
Points: 3723
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

antiscab wrote:

agreed, im not even ordering my replacement pack until m current one is dead.

i got burnt last time that happened, i ordered cells ahead of time, and by the time i needed them, there were far better cheaper ones around.

Matt

And I was hoping you would invent a Lithium pack replacement, then sell me your old pack.... ;-)

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antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1585
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

hey, that would solve my "eco footrpint" dilema of replacing a perfectly good battery (aside from its design flaws).

im actually developing quite a hate for ni-mh, everytime i need to go somewhere that needs most of the pack capacity, i have to do a full discharge at most 12 hours before hand....grrrrrr

on the upside, after a full discharge, i still get my 30Ah. 2500km now.

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

jurba
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Joined: 03/12/2009
Points: 97
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

17000 km .... I am more and more anxious ..... this situation drives me mad.... still no news of the lithium pack, still no news about a descent bms.... still impossible to know if the cells are balanced or not, what are they doing at vectrix ?

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kevin smith
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Joined: 12/29/2008
Points: 444
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

just sit tite .
and ride this baby into the ground .the lithiums are comming the lithiums are comming.
just enjoy .

R
R's picture
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Joined: 06/18/2009
Points: 1381
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

this situation drives me mad

I have experienced this situation before. I was expecting my vectrix by the beggining of 2006. I had to wait one year... Finally may 2007, "She" arrived.
Don't get anxious, the lithium is the short-therm bridge for the electric future, They will have it for sure: But it's better to wait a litlle and avoid having the problems we had with NImh... A lot of research still must be done!

jurba
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Points: 97
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

R wrote:

this situation drives me mad

I have experienced this situation before. I was expecting my vectrix by the beggining of 2006. I had to wait one year... Finally may 2007, "She" arrived.
Don't get anxious, the lithium is the short-therm bridge for the electric future, They will have it for sure: But it's better to wait a litlle and avoid having the problems we had with NImh... A lot of research still must be done!

Hi guy's,
thanks for giving me hope in our vectrix future .
maybe will be find lithium packs under the Christmas tree
regards
jean mi

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grillino75
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Joined: 08/05/2009
Points: 24
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

35000km done ,(22000km with last reconditioned pack battery)

Mik
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Points: 3723
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

grillino75 wrote:

35000km done ,(22000km with last reconditioned pack battery)

Very nice!

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marcopolo
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Joined: 05/10/2009
Points: 837
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

antiscab wrote:

i'm actually developing quite a hate for ni-mh, everytime i need to go somewhere that needs most of the pack capacity, i have to do a full discharge at most 12 hours before hand....grrrrrr. on the upside, after a full discharge, i still get my 30Ah. 2500km now. Matt

Matt,the average EV owner doesn't want to bothered with discharge, full discharge, deep discharge, or any other sort of battery maintenance. Can you foresee a time when a product such as Vectrix is equipped with a completely consumer friendly, (no involvement, no maintenance) battery system? It can't be that difficult a the Lexus hybrid requires no owner involvement.

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marcopolo

antiscab
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Joined: 07/07/2007
Points: 1585
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

marcopolo wrote:

Matt,the average EV owner doesn't want to bothered with discharge, full discharge, deep discharge, or any other sort of battery maintenance. Can you foresee a time when a product such as Vectrix is equipped with a completely consumer friendly, (no involvement, no maintenance) battery system? It can't be that difficult a the Lexus hybrid requires no owner involvement.

lol, I can't be bothered doing time consuming battery maintenance on a weekly basis :)

i sure can forsee a future where a vectrix has a user friendly battery. i even know how it could be done, i just don't have the cash to do it now (though i will in a few months).

unfortunately, it involves a fair bit of DIY. (actually fabrication work id just hand-ball to my favourite workshop)

LiFePO4 doesn't self discharge, so if you leave it for a fortnight, most of your range is still there (just like a gas bike!)
older controllers still draw 7ma of course.

the BMS im using (when used with an of the original software variants) just disconnects the charger from the AC, so theres not annoying 100w dump draw after charging.

LiFePO4 has a much wider temperature operating range, and far less self heating.

only funny part will be the fuel guage will under-estimate remaining range (perhaps not a bad thing?)

Matt

__________________

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst replacement TC Charger
conversion
Spent so far: $5800 + $7000 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost to do it again: $2500 + $5600 + $1720 + $960 + $320 + $720 + $140 + $600
Cost for a Petrol bike:$6000 + + $1440 + $6000 + $800 + $1400 + $3200 servicing
Total spent: $17260
Total to do again: $12560
Total to have used a petrol bike: $18840
Total distance travelled so far: 79'120km

Mik
Mik's picture
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Joined: 12/11/2007
Points: 3723
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

antiscab wrote:

...
...

older controllers still draw 7ma of course.
...
...

How about someone has a look at the MC modification so we can figure out how to retro-fit whatever they have added to the corner of the MC?

Here is a suggestion how this could be solved along with the inaccessible fuse problem: Move the fuse so that it is a mid-pack fuse (or rather a 27/102 - pack fuse); add a System Main Relay (Contactor) with automatic ICL at the 75/102 position; and Bob's your uncle, no matter if you use NiMH or Li batteries.

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This information may be used entirely at your own risk.

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grillino75
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Joined: 08/05/2009
Points: 24
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

40000KM!! (27000KM WITH LAST PACK BATTERY)
BYE FROM Italy

Mik
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Points: 3723
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

grillino75 wrote:

40000KM!! (27000KM WITH LAST PACK BATTERY)
BYE FROM Italy

Great news!

How did you do it?

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RaDy
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Points: 327
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

congratulations!! 27.000kms with 1 battery pack!! That seemed like an impossible dream 1 year ago.
How much time did you take to do those 27.000kms?
Rady

R
R's picture
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Joined: 06/18/2009
Points: 1381
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

40.000 km!! incredible! Congratulations! You must live in cold northern Italy, near Milano... Please, explain a little your driving/charging routine...
I'm around 25.000 km. 15.000 km with my last battery pack. Rady, xavier's Vectrix is death, and his warranty is over. We'll try to look for a death cell and shunt it, and cross fingers for the lithium's arrival...

grillino75
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Joined: 08/05/2009
Points: 24
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

ciao io abito a Roma vicino al mare!! ho comprato il vectrix usato con 900 km dal vectrix store di Roma verso marzo 2008,era usato per farlo provare ai clienti.
verso gennaio 2009 ho cambiato le batterie dato che con il vecchio software si erano rovinate ,ora con il nuovo software non ho piu' problemi con le temperature perche' posso ritardare la carica.
uso il Vectrix tutto l'anno per andare a lavoro (36km) quindi circa 72km al giorno ad una velocita'di 65-70km (con un'autonomia di circa 60km) .
questi ultimi 27000km sono stati perfetti e la batteria sembra essere rimasta efficente al 100%

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/3694/dscf1317v.jpg

eyeinthesky
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Points: 122
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

grillino75 wrote:

ciao io abito a Roma vicino al mare!! ho comprato il vectrix usato con 900 km dal vectrix store di Roma verso marzo 2008,era usato per farlo provare ai clienti.
verso gennaio 2009 ho cambiato le batterie dato che con il vecchio software si erano rovinate ,ora con il nuovo software non ho piu' problemi con le temperature perche' posso ritardare la carica.
uso il Vectrix tutto l'anno per andare a lavoro (36km) quindi circa 72km al giorno ad una velocita'di 65-70km (con un'autonomia di circa 60km) .
questi ultimi 27000km sono stati perfetti e la batteria sembra essere rimasta efficente al 100%

http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/3694/dscf1317v.jpg

TRANSLATED

Hello, I live in Rome near the sea! I bought a used Vectrix with 900 km, from store in Rome, March 2008,
it was used as a Demo.
until January 2009
I changed the batteries because the old software had been ruined, now with the new software I no longer have 'problems with temperatures because' I can slow the charge.
I use the Vectrix all year to go to work (36km) and then about 72km a day to velocita'di 65-70km (with a range of about 60km).
27000km latter were perfect and the battery seems to have remained at 100% efficient

R
R's picture
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Joined: 06/18/2009
Points: 1381
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

I no longer have 'problems with temperatures because' I can slow the charge.

Thanks for sharing... but wait a minute... How can you "slow" the charge?

AndY1
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Joined: 06/17/2008
Points: 1071
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

I think words were lost in the translation. Maybe he's referring to delayed charging with pre-charge cooling delay.

pengo
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Joined: 06/06/2009
Points: 15
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

Correct translation is "delay", not "slow"

RaDy
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Points: 327
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

Today i reached the 10.000km mark, and coincidently it was at plaza St. Jaume , right in the Heart of Barcelona, where we have the Generalitat (Catalan Goverment) and the City Hall (Major of Barcelona) so i stopped and took some pics.
Happy moment for me, after 10.000kms only 1 problem (noisy gearbox) which has been fixed and never happened again.
I keep my fingers crossed for the next 10.000kms!!
RaDy
IMG_0178_0.jpg
IMG_0180.jpg

AndY1
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Joined: 06/17/2008
Points: 1071
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

Congratulations! I have gone past 7.000km a week ago. Hoping for many more to come.

snail
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Joined: 06/16/2009
Points: 79
Re: Maximum kilometres or miles

I just passed through 8,000 miles (nearly 13,000km) today. My V will be three years old on Sunday 6th June. In that time, I've got had three rear tyres, two front tyres, three chargers (all under warranty - I'm dreading paying for the next one), a battery pack replaced under warranty (as a precaution, my cells appeared not to suffer the dodgy wiring problem) and a new seat spring. Apart from that, it's been a trouble free three years!

MOT test on monday - wish me luck...

Brian

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