Hello,
Just bought a Vectrix and I love the bike but I am not sure if its running the way it should. The bike is in overall excellent condition with about 1500 miles on it. My understanding is that is has sat through most of the winter at the previous owners. I took it out on Monday after giving it a full charge wanting to test the range. After about 20 miles of driving mostly 40 - 45, with some short distances of speeds up to 55, the remaining distance gauge dropped from 10 miles to zero, battery light came on and the bike when into a limited speed mode.
When I got home I plugged in to charge and came in and started reading everything I could here. Battery was at 29C when I started charging and dropped to 27 during the charge.
How do I determine the condition of the battery? I dont want to damage it more if there are unbalanced cells in the pack but a bike with a 20 mile range at 40 - 45 wont do me any good where I live.
I opened the battery box and measured the cell voltages of the top layer and they are all between 1.371 and 1.375 after being fully charged and sitting for a day. I was told the bike was bought from a dealer last year and has both the latest firmware and the battery recall done.
I am wondering if part of this could be from sitting over the winter. What is the safest way to test the condition of the battery?
Thanks,
Todd
Can you test cells' Voltage when the battery is almost empty (limited speed mode)? That is the right indicator for measurement.
20 miles at 40-45mph is not enough range.
Congrats for the purchase. It is a wonderful bike with a disastrously managed battery. You'll end your/our nightmare when we all upgrade to BMS lithium. Hehe.
You are waking up the battery after a large resting period? Do some cycles, maybe you'll get better mileage. The battery has a hi self discharge rate, you'll get maximum mileage when you unplug a charging bike and ride it immediately.
How old is your bike? It is interesting to know, the Vectrix production had some improvements, like the 200Ah fuse. Have a look at the front part of the battery compartment, behind the front wheel, you'll find a white stick with the serial number (last 4 digits are interesting)and date of build (month and year).
I will drive it more and see if the range improves. Just dont want to damage the batteries if I have an opportunity to save them before they are harmed. Is Vectrix currently honoring warranties on the bikes and do you have to be the original owner?
Last 4 of vin - 1053. Sticker says July 2007.
These bikes work best when they are used best. Weeks of sitting and lots of short discharge runs will both shorten the range of the bike, but it is easily brought back up to snuff with a few full discharge ride/charge cycles. Your bike has been sleeping. You just gotta wake it up with two or three run downs, and you'll see a nice increase in range (assuming that your distance isn't loaded with steep hill climbs). At an average 45mph, you should settle nicely into a 28 to 32 mile range (depends a lot on terrain). If you need more than that, you need a gas burner.
Don't stress yourself out trying to reinvent or second guess the bike. Just ride it, plug it in, ride it plug it in, and enjoy it.
Thnks for checking. You have waterproof connectors in the charger, Old Vin system, and (if it wasn't blown before) you still have the 125 A fuse. I recommend you check and upgrade to 200 A fuse.
That's why I told you to check the cells' Voltage immediately after you get into limp mode. Don't do any unnecessary deep discharges.
I never do any discharge below 5 battery bars left. I only did one discharge until the red battery telltale and that was it. My Voltage is fine, I have no Voltage depression (memory effect) and I use my battery mostly between 8-14 bars full. Up to 14 bars at charge and up to 8 bars on discharge.
I only charge fully when I know I will need max. range. And don't use regen above 13 battery bars full. It will mostly heat the battery than charge it.
That's why I charge my battery up to 14 bars 90% of the time. I don't stress the battery by charging it above 80% SOC and I can use regen almost immediately after I drive away.
I took it out and ran it again until the battery light came on, this time being careful and watching my speed and acceleration, the manual indicates this is part of the battery conditioning process. I did get 32 miles averaging 40 mph, not exceeding 40-45 mph for anything but a short period. So that was better but still not what I expected or what the manual would indicate is normal.
I live in a rural area and its 7 miles to the nearest town, at least half of that is posted 55 - 60 mph so I really can't go much slower than 55 without some danger or pissing people off. The road at the front of my subdivision is 55 mph. If I could get 20+ miles at 55 mph I would be more comfortable, which the manual states is possible, since I could drive the 10 miles( 5 down and 5 back) at 55 - 60 mph and the rest at 45 mph. I will drive it more and see how it goes.
I have had electric vehicles before and I have a Honda Insight that I regularly get 70+ mph so I know how to drive energy friendly. Just don't want to venture out and get stuck.
Todd
Is it hilly where you live? That makes a massive difference to range, particularly at higher speeds. I have the same problem.
Range of 40km when driving on hilly 80km/h roads.
This information may be used entirely at your own risk.
There is always a way if there is no other way!
For reference, my Vectrix is used regularly and I achieve somewhere in the region of 25-27 miles with 2-4 bars remaining at the end of my journey which is approximately 2/3 50-60mph and 1/3 30-40mph. I use regenerative braking wherever possible. If I ride steady for the last couple of miles, my estimated range starts at 35 miles after a full recharge, taking in to account the high speeds. After riding the 1st part of my journey at a steady 40mph, the estimate ranges changes to 40-45 miles within a mile or so.
At the weekends, I go for a ride a lot slower around town and my estimated range shoots up massively. I reckon I could achieve 45+ miles or so riding around like that.
May be worth checking your tyre pressures. I do mine every 2-3 weeks and always over inflate by around 2 psi.
For even more reference, i do a roundtrip of 45km a day and 30% on steep hilly roads, i end up with 3-5 bars depending on how "fit" my battery is since the last "Gauge Recalibration Procedure" which i normally do once every month and a half.This is driving normally 50% 80km/h (Ring road) and 50% at 60km/h (city), the day i am in a hurry and thrash it abit, i hardly reach with 1 bar and i get the red battery light, which i take advantage of by planning the "GRP" and if i drive very very gentle because i have to plan an extra trip out of my commute i can get around 65km, but here i have to control my instincts and coast as much as possible, and if i really really control myself and drive like a vicious energy administrator, then i can get 72km.
So it depends on the health of your batteries, how well they are "calibrated" , the way drive , the roads you drive on(steepness etc..), also on the temperature...and off course many more like your weight , the wind etc.. etc..
So the conclusion is that you have to experience and try out what is possible, expecting to get stranded the first few times but with abit of hindsight not too far from a plug.
Theory is very nice but experience is what you need because all of the above points apply to you in different ways that they apply to me, so you can have an idea of ranges of other people but maybe they are useless for you.
I hope that helps you.
RaDy
Is anyone (like Google Earth) offering a "profile" service for a given comute or route? I know some GPS devices can show you the route in a graphical form including the elevation / steepness of it all.
With a bit of software engineering we might be able to develop a "rating" system for a route over a specific terrain. Type in data into a route planner, check that it is really going along the route you want, and then it spits out the likely kWh requirements per 100kg of tare + load at a given speed.
Of course, air pressure (weather+elevation above sea level), aerodynamic properties of the loaded vehicle and driver behaviour are also important variables.
So, to start simple, which free program can show us a graphic of the terrain profile of a route chosen on an electronic road map?
EDIT about one minute later: http://freegeographytools.com/2007/altitudes-and-terrain-profiles-in-google-maps
You just gotta love the internet!
This information may be used entirely at your own risk.
There is always a way if there is no other way!
I use the "perfils" program (full freeware). It can show you a graphic of the terrain profile from a KML track generated in Google earth (or from GPS, in many other formats)
First I draw the route on google earth, export it to KML, open it with "perfils", it will automatically downloads the terrain profile from internet. If You add way-points inside the kml, they will be displayed in the terrain profile.
If the track is generated from a GPS, it will have the terrain data embedded inside the track file.
It's easy!. The only drawback? I'm not sure if it is avaiable in english....
download page:
http://www.amigosdelciclismo.com/Perfils/
It is about this hilly on my commute:
And my riding style is the opposite of AndY1's - I bought the Vectrix because it had the best specs of all that was available, and I need every bit of it's performance just to flow with the traffic (or maybe stay just a little bit ahead... ;-) )
Most accelerations are full throttle for me, because the thing is so lame off the line! Once I get to 50 or 60km/h I ease off on the throttle, because there is much more power available at that speed and I do not usually need all of it.
As you can see, there are some decent hills between my place and my work place; no way I can go slow on those roads, some idiot in an SUV will tailgate me in no time if I tried! And then what if a Kangaroo jumps out of the bush?
This information may be used entirely at your own risk.
There is always a way if there is no other way!
Todd, just to keep it short. I get about 20 to 25 miles of average to slow driving and 17 to 21 miles of faster average driving to five bars on gauge. Mik posted his version of "dead" at five bars so I thought that is good enough for me. I have gotten 39 miles of Sunday driving enjoying scenery sometimes but I might have to put in a voltmeter to see if I have any dead cells. I presume my battery pack is still good.
Rusty
KB1UKU
An update.
I used the bike first time for real this week , other than testing. I rode 17 miles to a friends, did some errands then back to her place, charged for about 80 min and then drove the 17m home. Just before home the battery light came on. All the driving was 40 - 45 mph or slower.
The red light concerned me because the 17 miles should have been easy based on my speed and the fact I had well more than half bars when I started home. When I left home initially I was not sure I would be able to charge when I got there so I drove very conservatively, 35 - 40 mph, thinking I may have to drive 34 mile round trip without charging. After running the errands it was clear I needed to charge so I picked up an extension cord and did some charging there. In the end I had ridden 46.4 miles. Not bad over all but with very conservative driving and over an hour of charging still getting a red light with 4 - 5 bars was disconcerting.
Battery temp never went over 26C riding or charging.
I live just north of Houston Tx so its pretty flat, some rolling hills and grades but it's nothing like what I grew up with in Washington St and nothing to stress the batteries.
I left the bike over night and then plugged it in the next morning to charge about 10 hrs later.
The range seems to be better but not dependable. I mean I can't count on either the battery meter or the range indicator - when it gets down to the lower 1/3 of the soc I can get the battery light at any time.
Hey Todd - welcome and congrats on the new toy!
I think you are going through what every Vectrix owner goes through; the disappointment of the range. Vectrix advertised their range of "35-55" miles, but readily admitted that this was measured with the Vectrix sitting on a test-machine, in the lab, with the speed set, until the battery was dead. If you put your Vectrix on a treadmill and run it at 10 MPH you will probably go 100 miles! ;-)
The point is that Vectrix, like all EV companies, advertise their best-case-scenario. Real-world riding is very different. You can't avoid starting/stopping/accelerating, etc.
I commute to work 20 miles each way, on the freeway, at full speed (60 MPH). When I get there the gauge says I have 4 or 5 bars left, but those last few bars are pure illusion and disappear very quickly.
Just for fun I did a range test at 25 MPH a couple of weeks ago. I rode slow and steady until the bars were gone and red battery light came. My odometer read exactly 48.5 miles; it was a loooong ride, not something to be done on a work-day ;-)
That said; I LOVE my Vectrix. I have over 5K miles on it. I ride it whenever I possibly can :-)
Enjoy!
Good news! Vectrix U.S.A. seems alive and well! I actually TALKED to their service man today, on the telephone! I called the U.S.A. office, at 1-508-717-6510 to reach vectrix. They will look at my bike when they next visit my area, near Washington, D.C.---Good luck, Bob Curry
Robert M. Curry
Great News! Thanks for the update!