Very Quiet Here

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PJD
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As someone following the development of the CMC scooters, This forum has been uncomfortably quiet. Any test-scooter customers wish to update us on their experiences? Thanks.

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jdh2550_1
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Re: Very Quiet Here

Hi,

It has indeed been quiet here - but we are still alive and kicking and making good progress. Here's a micro update:

On the business side of things we're "growing up" - transitioning from "starving start up" to "hungry young business". We're in the process of closing on funding and after that happens we'll start hiring key positions. As our lead investor says "it's time for CMC to become a real business" (hey, I've always thought we were but I do know and appreciate what she means!)

On the technical side of things we continue to make good progress on the details. We've had some reliability issues but with each one encountered we've discovered the root cause and been able to mitigate or fix. It's running at about 50/50 between "engineering issues" (those that feed into our basic design) and "production issues" (those that feed into changes in how we put things together to ensure a quality result). For example I'd say that electromagnetic interference (EMI) on the BMS wires is an engineering issue whereas cell interconnect issues is a production issue.

On the timeline side of things like almost everyone else we got caught up in the "we're nearly finished" syndrome rather than realizing the asymptotic nature of development. The last 20% of "stuff" takes 80% of the time and/or you're never finished. Call us rubes for falling into this trap if you like - but look at the delays that exist with every other EV venture large or small and I still contend that we have a streamlined and speedy development process.

On the delivered bikes - we're now almost up to 4. Two are local (a C124 and a C120E), one is MikeB (a C130) and the other is strawhistle (C130). I say almost - because strawhistle should be getting his delivery right around now. All of our customers continue to be very supportive of us and incredibly patient. However, they really do feel like partners to us - and they seem to be happy. We will be having MikeB's bike shipped back to us in the next week or so and will upgrade him to the latest and greatest of everything.

On production and delivery - We hope to have 10 bikes on the road by early next month and around 20+ by the end of the year (the sales of those bikes in November and December will be challenging - but hey, we like a challenge!).

On R&D - some good ideas coming in this area. Unfortunately I'm not at liberty to discuss them - but we still know that this is the start of the journey and there's lots of ideas we still want to implement.

Sorry for the quietness here and on our blog. Hopefully we will be able to find more time for regular communication. I'm doing my best to keep an atmosphere of transparency and open communication with both customers and the community here at CMC. However, at times I'm a bit like that plate spinner you see at the circus crazily running around trying to keep everything up in the air not crashing down to the ground ...

Thanks for your interest. Keep watching us and I hope you'll agree that you'll see good things. Keep nudging us for more news as well. We appreciate it!

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

strawhistle
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Re: Very Quiet Here

My c130 arrived this morning! I spent the last few hours playing with it ! It Is Good Looking, fit and finish is excellent, It is heavy but I can balance it at 3mph. I don't know what all the bells and whistles quite do yet, but I found reverse! good quick acceleration.The brakes are adequate!. I haven't had it out on the belt line yet, so I'll post again in a few days after I use a charge up. I AM EXCITED!!! LaTeR

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tabloid
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Re: Very Quiet Here

I'm coming up your direction around the 1st of November for some camping and to make some factory tours at the RV plants over in Goshen, IN. Care to have a visitor stop by and take one of your mules for a test drive one day?

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jdh2550_1
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Re: Very Quiet Here

Tabloid - sure you can stop by and take a test ride. Google says we're 2hrs 45 minutes away from Goshen, IN. Give us a call so that we can arrange something.

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

jdh2550_1
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Re: Very Quiet Here

Oh, and we're now up to 5 production bikes on the road. We delivered a red C124 this weekend. We'll be doing a push for year end sales once we get the website updated. We currently have November delivery slots available.

__________________

John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

strawhistle
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Re: Very Quiet Here

Hay John , I really Like this bike, it is comfortable to ride ! great sense of balance, good brakes , and I got the bike up to 68MPH so it does what you said it would do!! I already have had 3 people stop and ask questions about the bike and were it came from (I am proud to say made in the USA ) LaTeR

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MikeB
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Re: Very Quiet Here

And it's official: my C130 is now on the truck back on it's way to Michigan. I'll be getting a higher spec controller installed, a hub motor replacement, updated BCU software, a reworked DC/DC converter, and a thorough inspection for wear points and loose connections. It's nearly a full rebuild, and will give Erik a good chance to see how the bike held up to regular usage.

I've put just over 1,700 miles on the bike to this point, and have had a few issues. The CuMoCo guys have treated me well, even if they weren't able to immediately solve everything. But the new parts should take care of most everything we've talked about so far, other than pure wish-list items like a digital dashboard.

My biggest complaint to date was low torque at slow speeds, and the larger controller should provide a big improvement. We also had a problem with how the BMS finished charging the pack, which I think is solved as well. And the new software should give me a working fuel gauge, as well as some other tweaks. I may have a weak battery cell or two as well, since I think I've been hitting LVC earlier than I should, but those will get tested and replaced as needed.

It was an interesting experience, being the first and only rider of a brand new bike, but I'm glad to see other bikes are getting delivered now.

Now I just have to sit and be patient for a few more weeks, until my bike is delivered back to me.

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PJD
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Joined: 11/22/2006
Points: 1243
Re: Very Quiet Here

Two questions for you or John,

Do you know what the maximum current the old or new controller drew/will draw from the pack?

Also, related to your comment on the low-speed torque, were you able to test the performance of the C130 on any steep hills (say 12-20 percent?)

Paul D.

MikeB
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Re: Very Quiet Here

PJD wrote:

Two questions for you or John,

I don't know exactly what limit the controller is set at, but I know John has mentioned the 3C limit for the Thundersky batteries. 3C on 60ah cells would imply a 180 amp upper limit, but expect a safety margin to drop that a bit lower, and thermal protection will also keep you from using all that current for any length of time. One of the things I like about these bikes is the temperature monitoring, both in the controller and in the motor, so they can let us use more power briefly and then restrict the flow a bit once things start to get overly warm.

I have to cross the Chattahoochee river on my daily commute, so there's a steep hill for me in both directions. One hill is at least 10% for 1000', the other direction has a stoplight about halfway up the hill. My experience was that the bike could climb each hill just fine if it had some initial speed, but didn't do as well if you were moving too slow or got caught by the light. The larger controller should do significantly better on my hills, so I'm anxious to give it a try. Erik talked to me about some of the testing they did up in MI, I don't know if they found a matching 10% hill but they did get some good testing done. (Erik is skilled at instrumenting a vehicle and getting precise measurements.)

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strawhistle
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Re: Very Quiet Here

well my c130 has gone about 61 miles. Even though I charged after each ride ,the fuel gauge continued to drop to empty ??? I called John and he sent me three cables and a software program to figure out what !! after a few phone calls from John and Cris, and use of two of the cables we found that the SOC (state of charge) didn't reset, It may have been a lose connection at the charger, so we reset the Cpu? and the guage is now working It's raining out today so I can not ride to test the fix yet but with the quality of help I am getting I have no fear!!! Plus My intention is to be able to (Sell And Service) these "American Made" cycles up here in northwest WI.-Minn. so this is a good Learning experience!!! LaTeR

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strawhistle
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Re: Very Quiet Here

OK The fuel gauge is all fixed!! That was quick and easy ! now I am getting high wind and Cold rain for about a week will report! LaTeR

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thank GOD I wake up above ground !!!!

jdh2550_1
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Re: Very Quiet Here

PJD - I don't have amp draw on this PC. However I do have some range testing data (where I've already coalesced volts and amps to power).

Now here's something I don't think I've seen any other manufacturer match in terms of data. The power is calculated from battery voltage (so includes sag) and battery amps. So this is what the "battery sees" not what the "motor sees". Speed and distance are both measured by counting wheel revs (actually by counting hall sensor firing and dividing by 28 to get wheel revs). As the note at the top of the data table says - this speed profile gives a 40 mile range. That's less than our 50 mile quoted range - but the speed is higher than the "average trip".

tripdata2.PNG
speeddistro.PNG

I challenge you to try and get this data from any other manufacturer...

__________________

John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

jdh2550_1
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Re: Very Quiet Here

strawhistle wrote:

OK The fuel gauge is all fixed!! That was quick and easy ! now I am getting high wind and Cold rain for about a week will report! LaTeR

This was a software version (mea culpa! I'm responsible for the BCU code). The charger was working, but the BCU "thought" the batteries were empty so it was restricting the throttle. The "write the SoC to EEPROM" code was the culprit (well, I was the actual culprit but let me bestow that honor on the code.) This was a step backwards - i.e. a bug I introduced in an interim build of the software.

Bottom line is it works now. With great customers like Mike B and Mike K we're able to shake out the bugs and get them working with us.

Mike B's bike is getting reworked - yes we found at least one bad connection. We've changed our battery connection process since we shipped that first bike. Also, the BMS had some glitches - not sure whether we're repairing the BMS or installing a new one. The motor controller is moving from a 300A unit to a 400A unit (even though we peak at less than 180A the bigger controller allows more power through at lower speeds).

Progress is progressing.

__________________

John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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