EVT 60 volt mod

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dermutt
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

Hi Crusher

Thanks for the update!
Good to hear that the mod is still working well. Its interesting that the motor seems well capable of handling the extra voltage without problem, despite the slight increase in temp you mentioned. I like your theory about the 60v conversion roughly equating to the 48v unrestricted controller. Its a shame the range is not increased though - I hoped it might be, at least a bit.
Regarding hill climbing, do you think its worse than before the conversion?

I've been intending to convert my bike for a while now, so its reassuring to get a positive long term test report.

Lone-rider - my bike is a 168 too. My plan is to cut a hole in the foot board and stick an extra full size battery down there - I need to keep the range. There's space between the frame tubes to fabricate a battery box/holder. The battery sticks up above the foot board about 3" at the front, so some kind of cover is needed. Its restricts the space for your feet a bit, but it does keep the centre of gravity low. I don't think sticking a 50AH battery in the top-case would do the handling any favours!

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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

Dermutt:
I'd love to see what you come upwith for the battery holder cut into the floor :) If it works out well for you can you take pictures of how you did it so I might do the same. Thanks ;)

It seams that my EVT-168 is unrestricted already ???!!! I get top speeds of around 33 to 34mph. (with a full charge) at least thats what shows on the speedo . Using E mode I can get 28mph easy. then in P mode well past the 30 on the speedo. Does this mean that my used 2003 model EVT168 Gray/tan was an import with the asian controller???

I'll take a picture of the controller if that helps identify it.
100_1054.jpg
100_1056.jpg

XM-3000 BB Batteries using 5 vector smart chargers in bike
EVT 168 4 UB12500 batteries using 4 vector smart chargers

Crusher300
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

dermutt,

hill climbing is definitely improved, but it was pretty lousy to start with. Best to avoid hills where possible. The trick to hill climbing with the EVTs is to back off the throttle as much as possible, rather than open it up as you would for a gas scooter. The modded 4000e can climb short steep hills very slowly, but the motor heats up pretty hot. It slows down quite a bit on overpasses at speed, but they are still do-able.

-Crusher300
Silver EVT 4000e (60 volt) San Mateo, CA

Crusher300
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

lone_rider,

are you getting those speed numbers from the scooter odometer? I hate to burst your bubble, but the EVT odo is off by a good bit. Someone on another board coined the term 'EVT units' to describe the increments on the odo as they are neither Km or Miles. Only reliable way to measure speed is with a GPS. If I recall correctly, when I got a true 34MPH on the GPS the EVT odo read about 45MPH. Yes, it's that far off. Seems to scale, the higher the speed, the greater the overshoot. My guess is that when your odo reads 34 you're actually going about 28-29MPH. If you don't have a GPS, you can have someone pace you in a car and see for yourself.

-Crusher300
Silver EVT 4000e (60 volt) San Mateo, CA

Deafscooter
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

I read your EVT 168's Speed Contoller your Tawain Made EVT with bone headlight Scooter Version.. -

Deafscooter's has only 48 volt and top speed 60 Mph maxuim on asian version EVT 168 Special edition scooter..

( Deafscooter's EVT 168 SE ( Asian version has adjust 4 Level on scerw port allow access the limited speed )
post-26-1161841799.jpg

post-30-1161039288.jpg

Unloaded Old Asian EVT 168 Scooter before Stripping and scrap them ( i have to Road Test for good parts to sale )
SCTa2.jpg

Here is old Asian EVT 168 SE Speed how actual 50 mph with GPS before i stripped them to piece and Scrap them
50mphEVT_0.jpg

Here Picture close up Speedo Meter is ACTUAL is MPH ( Mile Per Hour ) = Not kilo per hour like Tawain EVT 168
Scta3.jpg

http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/popupimg.php?5241
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/popupimg.php?5240

Craig Uyeda
Deafscooter

deafscooter

dermutt
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

Crusher -
I've always riden up hills at full throttle. (In fact I ride nearly all the time at full throttle - but hopefully on 60v that'll no longer be necessary!)
I'll try out your low throttle hill climbing tip - have admit that the motor gets pretty hot on long hills, even at 48v, although it doesn't seem to have suffered any damage.

Craig -
How I wish my 168 would do 50mph. In fact, even 40mph would be nice...!
Does the yellow scooter in your pictures have a battery mounted in the floor? And is the motor uprated on these bikes as well as the controller - the casing looks different?
Any tips on easy upgrades for these bikes, or is it just a case of swapping out the controller and motor for the high power ones?

Lone-rider -
I'll let you know how I get on with the conversion in a week or two, hopefully.

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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168
new Submitted by dermutt on Mon, 11/19/2007 - 02:48. -- Quote ---------
==================================================

Craig -
How I wish my 168 would do 50mph. In fact, even 40mph would be nice...!
Does the yellow scooter in your pictures have a battery mounted in the floor?
And is the motor uprated on these bikes as well as the controller - the casing looks different?
Any tips on easy upgrades for these bikes,
or is it just a case of swapping out the controller and motor for the high power ones?

==================================================

Yes Deafscooter here , Answer...

The Yellow one has 48 Volts Version ( three battery on floor and one battery sit over last battery)

Here is Picture.. Battery mount Floor and Stacked Version EVT scooter
frame168.jpg

The my Red EVT 168 SE and Blue Scooter also the Most EVT 168 Scooter like your one
like your one " bone headlight on scooter " the battery stacked on above seat areas

================================================

The Asian Special Edition is 48 Volts at 275 amps on Speed Controller
& 3.0 kW , 3.5 kW Special Hub Motor ( up to 60 Mph = ( 95 Kph top )
-
other USA Version Stricted speed controller is 120 Amps & 1500 watts motor

--

USA Version Hub Motor spinning is about 750 RPM unload Free Spinning
-
Asian Version Hub Motor spinning is fast 1,750 RPM unload free spinning

====

Craig Uyeda
Deafscooter

deafscooter

dermutt
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Re: 60 volt mod for EVT 168

Thanks Craig.
That yellow scooter is great - seems a better design to put the batteries down low and have some space under the seat.
Were these only ever sold in Asia?

Crusher300
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Re: climbing hills with 60 volts

dermutt,

yeah, watch out with the hill climbing if you do the 60 volt mod. Patrick from Electric Motorsport warned me to be careful with the throttle on hills after the mod. If you just open it up all the way the motor heats up quite a bit more than at 48 volts. I checked it with an IR thermometer. I'm a top weight rider, so YMMV. Keep an eye on the motor temp after you do the mod and go easy on the throttle up hills.

-Crusher300
Silver EVT 4000e (60 volt) San Mateo, CA

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Re: climbing hills with 60 volts

This Deafscooter here

Deafscooter's EVT SE Can do Hill Climbing up to 10~12 Degree Grade for 1/3 mile long
My Pink EVT SE ( asian Version with 3500 watts , 48 volts , 275 amps Speed controller )
Note: Speed Controller's Setting is Limit up to 40 mph Max, on #2 level Setting Switch ..

Here is Picutre...
PKhill1.jpg
-
PKhill2.jpg
-
PKhill3.jpg
This GPS recorded uphill climbed & stay speed is 24-28 Mph at 3/4 throttle power!

Craig Uyeda
Deafscooter

Edited by Moderator: This user has removed the pictures which were associated with this post.

deafscooter

mbqmbq
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

I have now driven 1850 km using 60 V and everything works fine so far.
I'm almost always using the Power setting and full throttle. My workcomute
is 15 km in city traffic (30 km roundtrip).
Overheating is not a problem but since I did the conversion in september
the temperatures has been low but so far the gobal warming has kept the
snow away. I'll stop driving when there is snow on the streets, so far
I'v been driving a couple of times on ice and snow but it's nothing I recommend.

Good luck with your conversions,
Magnus
Stockholm, Sweden

http://www.weather.com/outlook/travel/businesstraveler/local/SWXX0031?from=search_city

dermutt
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60v mod for EVT 168

A few pictures to show the 60v conversion on an EVT 168.

Lone-rider – this mod is definitely worth doing on a 168 - it does take a bit of sorting out the battery mounting, but its not too difficult!

On the 168 you have to find somewhere to fit the extra battery – unlike the 4000e, there’s no room under the seat. However, there’s a 50Ah battery space between the frame tubes under the floorboards – it’s a perfect fit.

60v168-1.jpg

I used a small tray made out of sheet metal to support the battery. The edges are folded up about 2cm all round the base and there are metal strips welded to the front and back edges. (I forgot to get a picture of the tray before installing it – but you can see the side of it below.)

60v168-2.jpg

The metal strips hook over the scooter frame tubes and are clamped behind holding the tray firmly in place for the battery to sit on. The frame tubes themselves keep the battery located in the right position – it’s snug fit between them. A luggage strap was used to adjust the height of the battery and tray until the metal strips were clamped in place. I decided to leave the strap in place and loop it over the top of the battery to hold it down. The whole thing is a lot more secure than it looks in the picture!

60v168-3.jpg

You can see the front metal strips going over the frame tube in the photo. The battery could be mounted an inch or two lower if you’re not bothered about retaining the original undertray moulding, but it does help to keep the worst of the road spray out.

Here’s a picture of the wiring:

60v168-4.jpg

Next, a battery size hole was cut in the plastic footboard and a couple of holes drilled for the battery leads (not shown in the pic) before putting it all back together.

60v168-5.jpg

I’ve since added a simple plywood cover over the top of the battery and a rubber car mat cut to fit around it on the footboard.

The modification certainly improves the performance of the scooter - I’d guess the top speed is up maybe 6 or 7mph. This particular 168 did a genuine 31 mph before (Asia spec controller perhaps?), but it was still a bit slow for safety on parts of my commute. The 6 or 7mph extra may not sound a great deal but it makes a big difference on the road! Acceleration seems much the same and hill climbing a bit improved despite the extra weight. Not sure about the range yet, but the batteries are past their best anyway. If only 60v of Lithium didn't cost so much...

Thanks very much Crusher (and Magnus) for telling us about this mod and thanks also to Patrick for supplying the wiring harness.

So, has anyone tried a 72v EVT?!

reikiman
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Re: 60v mod for EVT 168

So, has anyone tried a 72v EVT?!

I've heard of it having been done - and I've heard that the motor itself can easily handle 72 volts. However the controller cannot. ElectricMotorsport can do 72 volt conversion and I was told it involves an e.g. alltrax(?) controller.

- David Herron, The Long Tail Pipe, davidherron.com, 7gen.com, What is Reiki
- Electrified Electra To

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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

Dermutt,

nice work on the 60 volt mod for the 168! I considered the same battery placement on the 4000e, but wanted to keep the stock look for now.

Regarding running an EVT hub motor at 72 volts: Patrick advised against it. According to Patrick, Electric Motorsport had done several 60 and 72 volt mods to the EVT scooters. The 72 volt mods use an Alltrax controller and allegedly more than one had come back with heat damage to the hub motor. You might be able to get away with it if you limited the max amp draw to less than the stock controller, but you might fry your motor trying to find out exactly how many amps the motor can handle.

Then again, it might work out fine if you used the 3kW version of the EVT hub motor that Electric Motorsport recently added to their parts page...

-Crusher300
Silver EVT 4000e (60 volt) San Mateo, CA

dermutt
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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

Perhaps I'll forget any ideas about 72v for the time being then!

Like the sound of that 3kW EVT motor. It would be interesting to see a picture of it. I think Craig said his 168 SE had a 3kW motor, which had a sort of spiral pattern to the fins on the casing. But they seem to have made several different versions. Anyway, the performance of that sounded good, so a 3kW motor running high amps at 48v via an Alltrax controller might work out well.

The only real drawback with the 60v conversion that I can see is the extra weight. My battery pack now weighs in at about 80kg, and although I don't really notice the difference on the road, that can't be helping performance and range.

Money no object, 60v of Li would probably transform it. More realistically, I'd be interested to try a 60v silicone set up to see if the EVT would manage the kind of range reported for the XM2000.

Diver Damon
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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

I have measured the output voltage from my controller to the hub motor when travelling at full throttle. It measured 43 volts on a digital multimeter and the input voltage to the controller was measured at 48volts at the same time.
Has anyone considered using some sort of switch/relay arrangement to connect the battery voltage directly to the hub motor (bypassing the controller)once you have max speed via the controller to get bit of a boost in extra power??
Perhaps this could also be done with the 60 volt mod and boost power and speed even further

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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

I think David is running something like that. I would prefer to get an ungoverned controller.

I took a look at the wiring of EVT and I wonder now if it's not just possible to replace the genuine DC-DC converter with a 60V-12V converter instead of wiring a 48V feed. This way it could be possible to balance the power consumption on the 5 batteries and this could increase range a little bit.

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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

I used one of these for my bike: http://www.vicorpower.com/products/configurable/megamod/ which can be configured for a specific input/output. Kind of expensive, but it works very well.

[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/587-my-kz750-electric-motorcycle-project]KZ750 Motorcycle Conversion[/url]
[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/588-fixing-my-chinese-scooter]900 watt scooter[/url]
Pic from http://www.electri

Jerome
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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

I don't understand how the battery gauge is working on EVT. It should monitor the 48V pack voltage, shouldn't it ?
But when I look in the wiring it seems that the 48V feed coming from controller is only connected to the DC-DC converter...

Diver Damon
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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

From what I have seen, the battery gauge measures gets it's voltage from inside the controller. It is measuring the 48 volt pack from there.

Jerome
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Re: 72v mod for EVT 168

I found the answer. The 48V tap of the 60V harness is before the key switch so the 48v is applied to the controller logic too. Then 48v current goes from controller to DC-DC converter. So removing the 48v tap and replacing the DC converter isn't a good idea at all, never do that !

ChrisB
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

At last I have my EVT on the UK's road ....yay......I'm loving it.

Currently running it on a set of very tierd UPS batteries, looking at li-ion's and upping the voltage, however the pictures on this thread have all but vanished :-(

Does anyone know if the 60v mod is just a case of adding extra batteries or not, there are notes about an extra wiring harness ?? and cutting wires ?

Is there a schematic of what needs to be done kicking about anywhere

Cheers

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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Be aware!--Unless you have reset your "Low battery cutout", and changed the battery guage calibration, your vehicle will now allow you to discharge your batteries too deeply, resulting in battery damage, and range estimation will be optimistic. (Cutoff for discharge voltage should be changed to about 54 volts minimum, with 5 series 12 volt batteries)-The old, 48 volt cutout was probably near 43 volts, and this is too low for your 60 volt battery system.--Good luck/be careful!--Bob Curry

Robert M. Curry

Jerome
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Hi Chris,

First be carefull because the 60v mod will work on EVT4000E with (old) brushed motors only. I have a spare harness wiring (built by Electric Motorsport) lying around. I don't use it anymore because I moved to lifepo4 batteries few months ago. Postage to UK shouldn't be too much expensive (I'm in France) so if you are interested I can provide to you the 60V harness at a good price. Just let me know.

With the 60v mod the jauge and controler still sees 48V so all is working as before. The 60V is only applied to controller/engine main leads. Except that you run faster so if you drive very hard you can loose some range at final...

Cheers,
Jerome

ChrisB
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Be aware!--Unless you have reset your "Low battery cutout", and changed the battery guage calibration, your vehicle will now allow you to discharge your batteries too deeply, resulting in battery damage, and range estimation will be optimistic. (Cutoff for discharge voltage should be changed to about 54 volts minimum, with 5 series 12 volt batteries)-The old, 48 volt cutout was probably near 43 volts, and this is too low for your 60 volt battery system.--Good luck/be careful!--Bob Curry

Hi Bob, thanks for the warning, I'm fairly clued up when it comes to battery cut off voltages etc I'd almost certainly add extra instumentation anyway to keep an eye on things.
I was hoping someone would have a schematic on the mod as currently I'm not 100% sure if I'm going lifePO4 or back to LA's for a year or so until LiFePO's or similar become slightly more plug and play.

ChrisB

ChrisB
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Hi Chris,

First be carefull because the 60v mod will work on EVT4000E with (old) brushed motors only. I have a spare harness wiring (built by Electric Motorsport) lying around. I don't use it anymore because I moved to lifepo4 batteries few months ago. Postage to UK shouldn't be too much expensive (I'm in France) so if you are interested I can provide to you the 60V harness at a good price. Just let me know.

With the 60v mod the jauge and controler still sees 48V so all is working as before. The 60V is only applied to controller/engine main leads. Except that you run faster so if you drive very hard you can loose some range at final...

Cheers,
Jerome

Hi Jerome, no worries about the Mod, have already done a lot of reading up on which EVT's it will and wont work on, and mine is the early Brushed and so it should be fine.

What sort of price are we looking at for the harness.

I'm interested in your LifePO conversion as I'd prefer to go that way but just cant find the right plug and play option at the moment and cant face having to mess about constucting BMS's and chargers etc
I had looked at a PING pack but his BMS doesnt go high enough as the EVT pulls 110amps @ 48v and his BMS seems to top out at around 75-80amps

Any info is much appreciated

ChrisB

Jerome
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Hi Chris,

harness cost me about 90$ incl shipping so something around 50$ incl shipping to UK sounds fair to me isn't it ?

I don't use any BMS for now. I just balance the cells once a week using a small RC 8 cells charger (turnigy accucel). And yes EVT pulls a lot of amps. This is the reason I oversized the pack using 60AH thundersky cells. Instead of buying an expensive BMS I just bought larger cells. So range is much larger than my requirements, I hope it will live longer and it can cope with higher currents. My Alltrax is set to 100A max which is about 1.5C only. What I would like to find now is a better way to balance charge the cells on everyday charge (with the large 10A charger). But I want to keep things as simple as possible because I don't want to add tricky onboard electronics that can fail, burn or kill cells. So what I want is just a good balancing board not a real BMS.

There is another EVT 4000 here that was converted using 2x40H lifepo4 packs from ebay. Range is larger than 110kms according to the owner.
Jerome

Blackman
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Good Mornig every one ,I am Hannes from Germany ,I have a evt4000e with a 60 v mod.
He runs from the last 2 Yaers only perfect.

The High speed with GPS is 55 km/h .

I hope i can see Pictrues from the 60 v Mod.

Bye Hannes

MEroller
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

Why not make the pictures yourself, from your own 60V modded EVT? :-)

My rides:
2017 Zero S ZF6.5 11kW, erider Thunder 5kW

Electric tony
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Re: EVT 60 volt mod

I'm looking to do a 60 volt mod on my 2006 evt 168.... I would love to see the pics that have been removed. Does anyone out there want to help out a 168 nooby? I would be grateful for some insight and tips.

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