Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino - Part One

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Tue, 08/26/2008 - 15:44
jdh2550_1
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The good news is that here's the start of the data for the comparison review. The bad news, it's not the performance data yet - just the "other stuff".

1) I will be including performance data "real soon now"
2) A lot of the data is from manufacturers web sites - the final review will make clear which bits of data are verified
3) Please help with filling in missing pieces or correcting stuff

And finally, I'm amazed at how heavy the Vectrix is! Just imagine that motor in an XM-3500/EFun-D frame. Now that would be quick!

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Tue, 08/26/2008 - 16:24
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reikiman
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

Did "Alpha Products International" really manufacture the Efun? (obligatory programmer joke) Does Alpha Products International understand that with that company name they may never get out of Alpha?

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Tue, 08/26/2008 - 16:52
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jdh2550_1
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

Quote:

Did "Alpha Products International" really manufacture the Efun?

No, they didn't. The VIN plate for the EFun lists JIANGMEN HUARI GROUP CO. LTD. The VIN plate for the two XM's lists Alpha Products International.

Oops!!! Sorry - that's a bad mistake! Especially given all the talk over on another thread...

Good catch. Unfortunately I can't edit the original post. I think from this point on I'll just post a link to this info on another site - where I can edit and format it a bit more easily.

And, David, that's a VERY bad joke! ;-)

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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Wed, 08/27/2008 - 05:44
#3
Vectrix-NH
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

You keep comparing apples to oranges . Vectrix is the only 60 mph prodution EV bike at the moment.
I need to go 60 mph . with a load (I have riden 2 up = 520 lb and it gose great .lots of power). so when another bike dose that you can compare it to Vectrix
They all have they place . just as all the 35 mph ev cars .
And with the price differants if you don't need to go 60 mph get something else. they are all helping to save Gas.

Happy riding ,Herb

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Wed, 08/27/2008 - 06:22
#4
jdh2550_1
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

Vectrix-NH - the entire list consists of apples and oranges (one small electric scooter, two mid size electric scooter, one large electric scooter and one gas scooter). Only the EFun-D and XM-3500Li are really the same class of bike. The table is meant to compare choices out there - not persuade anyone model a is better than model b. But if model a suits someones requirements better than model b then the table helps. I realize that this is different than when Car and Driver compare luxury sedans or MCN compares 600cc sports bikes. However, at the moment there aren't enough bikes in any one class to do that. Also, unlike the car and bike world where folks generally choose a sub-category and then look at the options in the EV bike world folks often need to decide what category they want by looking at all the available categories.

Despite my teasing over on the Vectrix thread I do fully believe the Vectrix is a better bike. Likely the best EV bike out there right now. However, the gap is getting smaller. Last year there were only the small scooters (XM-3000 like top speed in the 40's), now there are larger scooters (XM-3500 top speed in the 50's). Yep, the Vectrix is still better (and not just due to top speed) - but what will next year bring?

To put it another way - yes I do keep comparing the XM-3500Li to the Vectrix and yes it keeps coming up short. But I do that so that we can work on closing the gap.

The one thing that does annoy me about the Vectrix is the way that it often is positioned in the press as the only electric motor scooter out there. Not that I blame the Vectrix press office - I'd do the same ;-)

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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Wed, 08/27/2008 - 06:23
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dshupp
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

John,

You ought to put this into a Wikipedia article. Then you could edit it all day.

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Wed, 08/27/2008 - 08:33
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jdh2550_1
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

dshupp wrote:

John,

You ought to put this into a Wikipedia article. Then you could edit it all day.

Good idea. I'll look into doing that.

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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Wed, 08/27/2008 - 15:27
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino ...

OR... on this very site you can use a 'book' page rather than a 'forum' page. We have the editing permissions configured differently for different page types. On book pages the author of a book page is able to edit the page at any time, whereas on a forum page the author of the forum post is not able to edit the forum post.

Create Content --> Book

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Fri, 08/29/2008 - 20:37
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fisher727
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino

John

I was wondering where you got the $68 price for the lithium Thunder-sky 40 amp batteries.
I have seen some priced at $100.

Eric Fisher
www.SiliconeBatteriesUSA.com

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Mon, 09/01/2008 - 17:12
#9
jdh2550_1
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino

Hi Eric,

Over at www.elitepowersolutions.com

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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Sun, 09/07/2008 - 11:38
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino - Part O

Hi everyone,

I just posted a thread in "Product Announcements" about a new web site project I just launched which would be a great place to gather this data. John, would you be interested in trying WikiPik for gathering your findings?

Thanks!
Markus

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Sun, 09/07/2008 - 11:46
#11
jdh2550_1
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Re: Comparing: XM-3000, XM-3500, EFun-D, Vectrix & Vino - Part O

greatguru wrote:

Hi everyone,

I just posted a thread in "Product Announcements" about a new web site project I just launched which would be a great place to gather this data. John, would you be interested in trying WikiPik for gathering your findings?

Thanks!
Markus

Yes, a thousand times yes.

Can I suggest that you add a flag against people's accounts. One that says "owner" and one that says "dealer" (and allow folks to have more than one flag). I want to post reviews but I want to make it clear I'm a dealer - as well as an owner.

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John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas. No Worries." - JDH, CuMoCo || "Make Volts Not War" - anon.

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XM-3000 XM-3500 EFun-D Vectrix Vino
seat height inches 28 32 32 30.5 30
handlebar height inches 38.5 41.5 41.5
top of mirror height inches 47 52 52 42
seat width @ front inches 6 6 6
seat width @ back inches 12 14 14
leg room - seat to steering column inches 11 12 12
leg room - floor to handlebar inches 26.5 28 28
wheelbase inches 55 58 58 60 48.5
length @ longest inches 73 79 79 69
width @ widest inches 33 29.5 29.5 27.5
tire brand Chen Shin Tire Chen Shin Tire Chen Shin Tire
wheel size - front 10 13 13 14 10
wheel size - rear inches 10 13 13 13 10
tire size - front 3.5x10 130/60 - 13 130/60 - 13 120/70 - 14 3.5x10
tire size - rear 3.5x10 130/60 - 13 130/60 - 13 140/60 - 13 3.5x10
suspension - rear twin coil over cartridge twin coil over cartridge twin coil over cartridge single coil over cartridge
suspension - front twin cartridge twin cartridge twin cartridge twin cartridge
battery - brand Greensaver Thundersky Thundersky
battery - model SP-27-12 TS-LFP40AHA TS-LFP40AHA
battery - Ah Ah 27 40 40 30
battery - LxWxH inches 7.72X5.16X6.54 7.48X4.57X1.81 7.48X4.57X1.81
battery - individual weight pounds 23.6 3.5 3.5
battery - nominal voltage volts 12 3.2 3.2
battery - replacement cost dollars 89 68 68
battery - count 5 20 21
battery pack - nominal voltage volts 60 64 67.2 125
battery pack - capacity kWh 1.6 2.6 2.7 3.7
battery pack - weight pounds 118 70 73.5
battery pack - replacement cost dollars 445 1360 1428
battery pack - life - cycles 400 1500 1500 1700
battery pack - life - mileage miles 8000 60000 60000 50000
charger - power kW 0.33 1.1 1.1 1.5
charger - approx charge time hours 8 to 10 4 to 5 4 to 5 3 to 5
brake - rear twin caliper 7" disc twin caliper 7" disc + ABS twin caliper 7" disc + ABS drum
brake - front twin caliper 7" disc twin caliper 7" disc + ABS twin caliper 7" disc + ABS single caliper 7" disc
speedo type mechanical mechanical mechanical
speedo units kilometer kilometer miles
odo type mechanical mechanical mechanical
odo units kilometer kilometer miles
manufacturer Alpha Products International Alpha Products International Alpha Products International Vectrix Yamaha
controller - peak volts volts
controller - peak amps amps 275
controller - low voltage cut off volts
motor - power rating watts 3000 3500 3000
motor - type Series Wound DC Hub Motor Series Wound DC Hub Motor Series Wound DC Hub Motor
peak power kW 21
weight pounds 320 276 276 515 240
max load pounds 300 400 265 423
warranty - motor months 6 12 12
warranty - batteries months 6 24 12
warranty - controller months 6 12 12
warranty - mechanicals months 6 6 12
range miles 20 40 40 35
MSRP dollars 2499 4499 2899
Street Price dollars 2499 3999 9772
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