XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

16 replies [Last post]
Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466

I have a couple of XM-3000 and a couple of XM-3100's and Headlight and turn signal stopped working and found the Converter under the floor mat and it was wet. The double sided stickey tape stuck to floor of bike along with specs saying 60 volt is 12 volt out I guess since it is backward reading thru tape. It seem strange that the color coding from the bike all of them says Grn, Blk, and Yel go into the converter Blk, Yel, then Red. in other words is the Green wire to go to the black wire on converter? Then the black wire of bike go to Yellow wire=10.5 volts when it did work. and the Yellow wire on the scooter is 68.0 volts to Fused red wire on converter. I have an open ticket but need to ride the bike so I think I will use a 12 volt battery for lights till order arrives.
It seem like a bad place to put an electrical device where it can get wet and fail. Strange color coding in my book. On my Vectrix the 12.0 volt is 11.5 volt out too. All seem to run on the low side of 12 volts. If there is room under headlight cowling I will re-mount it there? Also the yellow wire is fused for 20 amperes and the wire is about 18 or maybe 16 AWG. Safe? Not.
RUSSELL

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
warrantydude
Offline
Joined: 10/17/2009
Points: 7
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Rusty - I sent you an email but I'll post as well.

I have what is essentially an xm2000 and the converter just failed.

I want to wire a battery in for 12 volt just as you discribe but I can't figure out where to wire it.

You just can't wire it to the converter plug "out" wires. I tried that. I suspect you have to do it where the power lead goes into the PDI (for power) unit but I'm afraid to short it out.

As others on this forum know, all kinds of components have failed on my bike. Now this..

Any ideas would be helpful.

PEACE - Scott

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

"I have what is essentially an xm2000 and the converter just failed. "

Seems to be a common thing on extreme scooters!

"I want to wire a battery in for 12 volt just as you describe but I can't figure out where to wire it."

Easy enough

Grn on bike side Negative

Blk on bike side 10.55 volts

Yel on bike side 68.0 Volts

-----------------------------------------------
Converter pin out connections

Blk - Yel - Red
Neg - 12v - 68v
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since the converter failed, cut all power wires on converter flush and use the plug -in assembly to connect to battery pack or another DC-DC.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"You just can't wire it to the converter plug "out" wires. I tried that. I suspect you have to do it where the power lead goes into the PDI (for power) unit but I'm afraid to short it out. As others on this forum know, all kinds of components have failed on my bike. Now this.."

If you got to have a failure on XM series the DC-DC failure is the easiest to deal with.

I will try to upload a pix now?!.

I want you to know that when Battery is wired so you have lights, that it will be on 24/7. I used a 12 volt LiFePO4 from Thunder Sky to light up my lights and it is 13 real volt vs fake 10.5 volts on converter.

IM000212 (WinCE).JPGIM000213 (WinCE).JPGIM000214 (WinCE).JPGIM000216 (WinCE).JPGIM000217 (WinCE).JPG

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

I guess I have to explain something my wife picked up on. I painted the yellow wire RED on the cut-off portion of DC-DC. DO NOT use red wire on DC-DC for that is high joltage!!!! USE black and yellow on converter wire to SLI battery or Gel Cell or NiCAD pack. I timed my lights to match an hours of riding at 12 AH Lead Gel Cell pack to give enough head light till Traction pack requires charging. When I get home I charge both packs. The Thunder Sky is over kill for time use and stays bright till I get home. But at least it is very light in weight.
Rusty

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

marylandbob
Offline
Joined: 06/22/2009
Points: 520
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Using the thundersky LiFePO battery is a good choice, as the discharge voltage remains at or above 13 volts for a long time, providing better light output than the lower voltage of a lead-acid battery or the stock D.C. converter. Most automotive "12 volt" lights and other devices are actually DESIGNED to operate best with 13 to 14 volts applied. Normal battery voltage in most cars, with the engine running, is 13 to 14.5 volts. Headlights are noticably DIMMER at or below 12.0 volts, use 13.5 volts for good brightness and bulb life, higher voltage will be ven brighter, but exceeding 14.0 volts will noticably shorten bulb life. (At 15.0 volts, they WILL be BRIGHT!)--Vectrix also has low voltage, about 12.0 volts, ideal would be about 1.5 volts more.----Bob

__________________

Robert M. Curry

warrantydude
Offline
Joined: 10/17/2009
Points: 7
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Rusty -
I tried what you suggested - postive battery to yellow, negative battery to black on cut off converter plug and I burnt the fuse on the black bike side wire...

Isn't working for me. Your discribtion of the wires in and out seem accurate. I tested with a volt meter and the Red/yellow is 68,v the yellow/black is 10.55v and the black/green is negative ground.

Don't know what I'm missing.

The other issue is that it looks like you're just getting head light and tail light and not break light, shifter, or turn signals???? Or are you?

Thanks again for your help on this. I've rebuilt the whole bike as it has failed, but this is bugging me!

I hate the CHINESE! Specifically Moutain Chen and Allen Chen and their American "Renfield", Tracy Ingram of defunct Nova Scooters.

PEACE! Scott

marylandbob
Offline
Joined: 06/22/2009
Points: 520
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

To SCOTT: No, you have it backwards! Green is negative, or GROUND, and BLACK is POSITIVE, or HOT for the scooter 12 volt system! (I guess they took this from HOUSEHOLD wiring, for A.C. power, where BLACK is the "hot" wire, and GREEN is the ground.--My "Pantera" scooter was the same way, I replaced the underfloor D.C./D.C. converter with a bigger, better unit, installed under the seat. Now it has 13.8 volts at 12 amperes! Great for lights and accessories, including RADIO!-Bob

__________________

Robert M. Curry

warrantydude
Offline
Joined: 10/17/2009
Points: 7
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Robert - I realized I typed in in backwards, please see my revised post above...still doesn't work, just fries the fuse on the black hot wire...I'm missing something or there is a short somewhere up the line...

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Rusty -
I tried what you suggested - postive battery to yellow, negative battery to black on cut off converter plug and I burnt the fuse on the black bike side wire...

Isn't working for me. Your discribtion of the wires in and out seem accurate. I tested with a volt meter and the Red/yellow is 68,v the yellow/black is 10.55v and the black/green is negative ground.

Don't know what I'm missing.

The other issue is that it looks like you're just getting head light and tail light and not break light, shifter, or turn signals???? Or are you?

Well I don't know what to say unless...
There is Electronics id est solid state devices in 12 volt side of circuitry. Maybe solid state winkers "flashers"? controller? oh yes indeed oh yes? you see a 12 volt signal is fed into controller circuit for KILL when brakes are applied. Does your scooter work with out DC-DC or 12 volt SLI?
All my scooter can work on traction battery pack minus DC-DC
You have to have traction part work FIRST in order for everything to work after that.
My brakes work my brake light works headlight work on both high and low beams and even the funny light works as in the cyclops under headlight. Horn work turn signals works. So the only thing is traction three phase controller? is blowing fuse!!!IM000221 (WinCE).JPG

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

warrantydude
Offline
Joined: 10/17/2009
Points: 7
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

My motor circut works fine. Can run the motor. When the converter unit went out I lost all the "front" of the bike: lights, shifter, horn, etc...

What do you mean by SLI?

My scooter has the same converter as you show in picture.

I put an amp meter on the circuit from the converter plug to what I think is power out to the pdi meter and I think I might have a short in that line. Not sure.

Also, are you saying that when you take the converter out you still have horn, shifter, etc, just not head light?

I'm getting confused. Maybe just tired.

Thanks, Scott

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

SLI = starting lighting ignition. ICE = infernal combustion engine. EV = electric vehicle
just a generic battery. Sounds like you may have a real dead short some place in scooter. Get a battery of decent capacity small portable.
#2 get a light bulb of 1 ampere two ampere or three ampere amount, An RV bulb?
#3 connect Negative of 12 volt pack to as you call it green wire preferably thru BLACK wire on DC-DC cutoff portion for quick disconnect reasons and quick measuring.
#4 Run positive wire to test LAMP and other end of Lamp to fuse? and to Yellow wire on plug cut from DC-DC to BLACK wire on XM series which is common hot or common 12 volt to power all lights.
#5 If RV bulb glows BRIGHT. remove one wire at a time on all circuits to find short. BTW there is a wiring diagram of XM series some where on VisforVoltage some where, and on Extreme web site too. I just can't find it now. When the RV bulb finally dims to a dull glow, all blinkers and one of the head lights will glow too. When on full high beam it be be back to a dull glow til you go to a full 50 watt lamp for "smoke" testing purposes.
Again everything on my scooter is working till i get a new DC-DC thingy. Thingy = something that no one knows how it works.

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

sparc5
sparc5's picture
Offline
Joined: 05/21/2008
Points: 243
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

The DC-DC converter on my XM-3000 kicked the bucket last week. It had been making bad sounds pretty much the whole time I've owned it. Unfortunately my warranty had expired. Rather than pay the crazy price for a new one I just bought a computer switching power supply from ebay for $10 including shipping:

http://cgi.ebay.com/DELL-DA-2-Optiplex-SX280-AC-POWER-Supply-ADAPTER-GX620_W0QQitemZ260495453128QQcmdZViewItemQQptZPCA_UPS?hash=...

I wired the 110VAC input into the old 60V DC input from the batteries, connected the ground wires together, and the +12V to the yellow wire. Powered it on, and bingo, got lights again! I put silicon over the seams since this DC-DC converter isn't waterproof and put it into the "glove compartment" to keep it free from water. If it fails, it's only $10, I can try to do a better water proofing job.

__________________

XM-3000...
-DC-DC converter replaced with a Dell D220P-01 power supply.
-72V mod
-Expensive bank charger until I come up with something better... Still trying.
-Headway 10Ah LiFePO4 cells 24S2P, pack in parallel once the item above is ready.
-KEB72801 300A 72V 8.0KW (Enormous EV grin)
-DPDT relay to use throttle to control regen and to invert break/kickstand input.

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

WOW we
you got that puppy to work on a 60 volt scooter? I use those power supplies on my S-10 to run the Cruising equipment e-meter and other control circuits. I didn't know you can get it to run below 96 volt DC. My Iota draws big current at 96 volt input and hardly any current at 160 volt input so I figure laptop power supplies would do the same. I didn't know any one knew that if you saw on a power supply "operates from 100-250 volt AC it meant actually DC in or AC input.!!!!
I will try it now and see. Thanks I did it all the time on high voltage just never thought to use LOW 60 volt.
It will sure beat 12 volt battery supplying lights now.

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

sparc5
sparc5's picture
Offline
Joined: 05/21/2008
Points: 243
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Yeah, technically 67.5V but even after 50% DOD it was still putting out 12V. :) Look forward to hearing about your results.

__________________

XM-3000...
-DC-DC converter replaced with a Dell D220P-01 power supply.
-72V mod
-Expensive bank charger until I come up with something better... Still trying.
-Headway 10Ah LiFePO4 cells 24S2P, pack in parallel once the item above is ready.
-KEB72801 300A 72V 8.0KW (Enormous EV grin)
-DPDT relay to use throttle to control regen and to invert break/kickstand input.

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Yeah, technically 67.5V but even after 50% DOD it was still putting out 12V. :) Look forward to hearing about your results.

Again
Wow Sparkie you iz right
I did it. look at pix I used my laptop IBM and same connector but red + black = 68 volt and it made 16 volts for what ever as my laptop is a 16 volt converter so 12 volt converter should do same.
Nice reply I mean THANKS a whole bunchesIM000989 (WinCE).JPG

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

Spaceangel
Offline
Joined: 07/15/2009
Points: 466
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Now since I know that the 60 volt pack can run my laptop,I will put a NEMA 5-15 on the dash area and use my laptop at the Internet cafe' and Library here. The bike switch turns off 60 volt DC to outlet so it will turn off lights now when I get new converter.IM000003 (WinCE).JPGIM000004 (WinCE).JPGIM000005 (WinCE).JPG
Might as well do that to all my scooters including Vectrix. Plus the Vectric can use standard Iota and Progressive Dynamics converter too. They make Big current for 12 volt side, like on the order of 30 to 120 amperes.

__________________

jeGra Project
http://home.comcast.net/~russell239/
Rusty

sparc5
sparc5's picture
Offline
Joined: 05/21/2008
Points: 243
Re: XM-3000 & XM-3100 DC - DC converter

Glad I could help.

__________________

XM-3000...
-DC-DC converter replaced with a Dell D220P-01 power supply.
-72V mod
-Expensive bank charger until I come up with something better... Still trying.
-Headway 10Ah LiFePO4 cells 24S2P, pack in parallel once the item above is ready.
-KEB72801 300A 72V 8.0KW (Enormous EV grin)
-DPDT relay to use throttle to control regen and to invert break/kickstand input.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

Short URL

JensonUSA Bicycle parts and accessories
e-Bike Kit Electric bicycle conversion kits and accessories
Simply Car-free How to Pedal Toward Financial Freedom and a Healthier Life
Who Killed the Electric Car? Essential documentary explaining what happened the last time electric cars were killed
Customize This