Here we go again

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Bnzilla
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Joined: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 - 20:06
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Here we go again

Previously I reported the strange condition of the ever changing range. Sometimes the vehicle would go the full distance (30 or so miles) other times the red battery light would appear after 12 or so miles (current record is 10 miles) this is on the same terrain and driving conditions. I average 15 miles a day and usually charge every day. The reduction in range used to be every 5 charges or so and now it is unpredictable. I know that short of a complete diagnostic process it would be impossible to diagnose but I am beginning to wonder if this might be a software glitch in the charging process. If the issue was in the battery (dead cells) wouldn't the reduction in range be across the board instead of maddeningly random? Is this the death knell of a once great idea or should I just accept the inevitable slow decline and charge at every opportunity (7.5 miles). By the way the range is always good on the next charge after the red battery light goes on and I limp home.
Any suggestions? Open to the most wild of speculations. Thanx.

marylandbob
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Re: Here we go again

What voltage do you see at end of charging?-Bob

Robert M. Curry

HarryS
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Joined: Wednesday, October 8, 2008 - 20:06
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Re: Here we go again

Look at my recent post. I think what is needed is a regular deep discharge every 2 week or so.

volts76
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Joined: Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 19:38
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Re: Here we go again

My V got a battery replacement at 3500 miles. My max range was 26-28 miles. My new batteries are fantastic. I broke in the new batteries with the latest software. My ride to work is 14 miles. When I get home at 28 miles I charge. Enery other day a ride the milage into the mid to upper 30's to batt icon. I ride agressivly most of the time. Once a month I ride until 15 mph can not be maintained on level road. If I drive my V like I drive my car my range goes into the low to mid 40's.If I drive the back roads, mostly flat, and keep the speed between 30-35 I will get 55-57 miles right after an equilzation charge. If I do top off charges or do not let the charges complete, the range and fuel gauge get way off until ride to icon. I have 8800 miles now and I am happy. I live in Pennsylvania where the roads are rarely flat.

Bnzilla
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Re: Here we go again

Voltage at beginning of the day varies from 138 to 140 (after full charge throughout night). Tonight I emergency charged the vehicle at a friend's house for three hours and the voltage was 143. I have heard of higher voltages but I use a 120 volt outlet (I do not know if 220/240 would charge to a higher level). The one delineating factor is the voltage reading at the end of the first leg of my trip (7.5 miles). If this voltage is 134 then I know I have more than enough to make it home, at 132 it is more of a crap shoot as to whether or not at two bars above half (on the idiot gauge) the red battery lite (Vectrix version of Blue Screen of Death I imagine) will come on bars quickly disappear and within one mile I am scuddering about at something less than walking pace. Apart from this bit of inconsistency, I find the bike to be a real joy albeit a tad unreliable. If I take to charging at both ends of the journey the estimated mileage drops to around 22 until fully charged however, despite the estimated mileage at startup the next day showing around 33-34 miles the above (red light bar drop) will happen at ten or eleven miles. This has not always been the case and I wonder if a hard reset or reflashing the ROM would clear it up (software/hardware) issue I can tell you that it resets itself (if the above is indicative of resetting mileage/voltage calibration) without my help at the most inopportune time (hard day at the office, can't wait to get home sort of thing). Thank you for your interest in this rather perplexing, assuredly annoying issue. :(

AndY1
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Re: Here we go again

If your voltage, after 3 hours of charging at your friend's, was 143V at CC stage, that is ok, if at CP that's not ok.

Mik
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Re: Here we go again

It's easier to follow if the prelude comes with it:
http://visforvoltage.org/forum/7068-unusual-behavior

I have a 2007 Vectrix with 2300 miles from new bought November 2008. It has always been in a temperate climate (central California Coast) and has not been subjected to extremes of heat or cold. It is a daily driver, being driven 16 miles per day and charged each evening (on weekdays) with some weekend driving. It performs faultlessly yet every tenth day (like clockwork) on the way home at 50% charge the low battery light comes on, speed is governed to about 45 MPH and miles remaining drops quickly. When I get home and cycle the ignition there are no bars left on the meter (prior to shutting down there are at least 4 -5 bars left) with voltage reported as 126 volts and battery temperature at around 25 degrees Celsius. After charging overnight (I always use a four hour delay to charge at "off peak" times) it's ready to go for another 10 days. One last thing, immediately after the event the guestimated miles (on the guessometer) is 27 miles, the guestimated miles increase for the next ten days until the estimated miles is 39-43 then the above happens and the cycle begins anew. I have not been back to the dealer (I hear there was a patch issued for the new software around February this year) due to a slight misunderstanding regarding servicing. Does the patch address this problem, do I need to "deep discharge" the batteries more than the every month or so as is my wont, I am I headed down the path of "awsome paperweight dude" ownership or should I just enjoy the ride, be happy and not worry? Any advice would be helpful. If this has been addressed previously please forgive me as the memory is not what it once was. I have enjoyed reading the comments of the members of this forum for quite some time, the obvious knowledge and enthusiasm of the subject is evident in many of the postings. I appreciate any feedback in this matter.

So, what happened to this apparent clockwork regularity?

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Bnzilla
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Last seen: 13 years 6 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 - 20:06
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Re: Here we go again

Exactly, the clockwork regularity has been replaced by random "why me" sort of a thing. I understand that the process of diagnosing is difficult under the best of conditions (I was a Chrysler line mechanic back in the eighties) but to do so without the proper equipment and with my meagre understanding of of most things Vectrix coupled with a low frustration tolerance makes this forum a veritable blessing. The randomness is perhaps explained by recent opportunity charging which I may just continue although it is rather a pain to run a power cord at lunch at work and when I forget then the consequences are the above described rapid demise. Without the opportunity charging the regularity of the event is as originally described. The question then is why does opportunity charging create a 10 mile limit after just two such cycles? What is the nature of the issue? Hardware or software? Impossible to tell, if this has not been an issue for others then it is unique unto myself and the thread can be dropped as I look elsewhere for answers.
Thank you all for your kind attention to this matter.

Buzby
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Re: Here we go again

My V got a battery replacement at 3500 miles. My max range was 26-28 miles. My new batteries are fantastic. I broke in the new batteries with the latest software..

What do you believe is the 'latest software'? My dealer arranged last April (2009) which was the major October 2008 update with a February 2009 patch. Since then my riding patterns have not changed, but my range has halved - down from 48, to around 25. Frankly, I wish I hadn't bothered/ True, now when I get the O bars, showing, I can still get a few miles at 25mph (whereas before If I had no bars, I wasn't going anywhew) but there has bene no improvement, and I regularly spot the estimated mileafew when it is at 10m, dissappears in 250 yard increments until it disappears.

Not ideal.

- Raymond

volts76
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Last seen: 12 years 8 months ago
Joined: Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 19:38
Points: 62
Re: Here we go again

BCR3001 for battery control
ICMR1008 for interface control
MCR1017 for motor control

winged_racer
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Joined: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 - 04:53
Points: 85
Re: Here we go again

To check if you have the latest software is quite simple. With the bike in the on position, turn off the kill switch, squeeze the left brake lever and look at the left od of the instument cluster. If new software has been instaled you will see the at the bottom the voltage remaining and afte about 10 seconds the highest temerature recorded on the BMS sensors, for example 140 volts and 21 degrees C. What often happens in my experience is if the rider has been doing short rides between charges the battery monitoring and range calculation goes out of sync. In other words the software thinks, "Oh the bike only needs this amount of charge as it only gets ridden 4.5 miles and uses 4 aHrs current on average" so over time the batteries do not get the full 30 Ahrs charge they could take. I suggest you ide the bike until the red battery light appears on the dash (stay clse to a charge point for the last few miles!) then plug the bike in and let it get a full charge. Do this a couple of time and then at least once a month after and you should have happy batteries!

By the way, if you have the new software, use the charge delay to help cool the batteries before charging.

Doug Townley
info.DTES [at] gmail.com

(Formerly Vectrix Europe Technical Supervisor)

One door closes, another door opens

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