Howdy all,
Long term lurker and now a proud owner of a new green C-130 as part of the pilot program. I received my official title in the mail on Thursday from the state of Indiana with plates hopefully following in the next week. Very speedy / quick to get everything through the BMV and my local insurance so kudos to Current on making it fairly painless.
The sad part was that it had to sit in my garage for a week and a half until I could actually ride it due to time / travel commitments at work.
Fortunately, that got resolved with 150 miles of riding via commuting over two weeks and absolutely loving it :)
I hadn't heard of the C-130 before. Looks cool. I'm interested to hear how this scooter performs in the coming months.
"we must be the change we wish to see in the world"
Congrats; good to see another maxi-scooter rider.
Enjoy
Motorcycles: 2011 ZEV Trail 7100, 84V, 60AH, 60+mph, Cycle Analyst, TNC throttle, modified charger. 2013 Kymco GT300i
Bicycles: 2017 Sondors Thin
Cars: 2016 Leaf SV, 30KWH pack. 2007 CR-V
Solar array: 5KW. Cost per lifetime KWH produced $0.073
Bi
Now up to a full 230 miles ridden. I had passed on my initial thoughts to John and figured I would share them with the group. I recently picked up a microcontroller with a high quality gyro / accelerometer to add in / monitor my future rides. Going to bring that out via a PC to start and then eventually WiFi into my cell phone. If anyone has any mounting suggestions for the phone, let me know. It is getting a bit cold though so I don't know if there are many riding days left this year. We'll see.
To give a bit of overview on my commute. My commute is a bit over 8 miles with two paths that I can take. All of it is largely flat with this being the Midwest and all. On the one route, it is a two lane road varying between
45 and 35 mph over asphalt followed up by a dash of 45 mph concrete, a roundabout, and a brief but relatively sparse 4 lane road at 40 mph. The other route is an asphalt / concrete blend that has heavy traffic ranging from 40 to 50 mph. Mostly stop signs on the first with only a few stoplights, nearly all stoplights on the second. The second route is all four lane. My rationale for the C130 was for that second route to keep up with traffic.
I am 6' 1" coming in at just a hair under 200 pounds giving a healthy degree of wind resistance if I sit fully upright on the bike.
- Fantastically fun. Wish I would have picked one up earlier.
- Great construction quality, no major issues whatsoever.
- Speed-wise, there are no issues when cruising along on either route. I have hit 60+ on the four lane road keeping up with traffic and did not feel out of place. The middle acceleration on the bike (20-40 mph) is fantastic and it has a throw you slightly back in your seat acceleration if you crank it. Awesome :) If the speedo was to be fully believed, there was a 65+ mph speed one time but I am not positive how accurate it was. Still though, well done, well done.
- The low end / takeoff speed still needs some tinkering. Hopefully the v0.3 software helps but it really becomes noticeable sitting at a stoplight. If I am at the front, it feels very evident at the slower takeoff speed. Of course if I leave it full throttle, the 20-40 mph+ easily speeds away but the initial take off needs help. That is really the only time it felt underpowered and it does not have that electric high torque feel to it. On the stop sign path, it feels just fine as I don't feel the same pressure of traffic around me.
- I've tinkered a fair deal with the high / low setting. I have not had a tremendous need for the low setting. I occasionally use it in the parking lot but not terribly much.
- The rear shocks are pretty good but overall, the bike gets shook a bit too much on the concrete. Indiana does not do the finest maintenance and in the 40+ mph range, you definitely feel it.
- The lights are kind of meh but I was not expecting to ride the bike a lot at night anyway.
- Cars suck when it is hot. Gah, stoplights can be awful if is warm out :)
I will be curious what the v0.30 software does and if it improves things. The acceleration at the lower end is tolerable though, just not where I would expect it to be. If it keeps the batteries lasting way longer, then it certainly is a viable tradeoff.
Something tells me that the controller used in this bike is a tad on the conservative side Amp-wise. Kelly suggest using a controller rated approx 1/3rd higher than the expected ampere values. They integrate a hard-coded takeoff current limitation that will easily be way down low with a controller that seemd to be just right for motor and batteries.
Just as an example: my theoretically 5kw/8kw peak motor was orignally driven by a 100A/200A Kelly controller ("5kW") that would easily suffocate the motor down to 20A and less from standstill. Not only very boring or outright embarassing at stop lights but also highly impractical in more hilly environments when I would have to frequently even push-start the bike to bring motor revs up high enough for the controller to slightly increase the current to a value high enough to continue uphill acceleration without further mechanical rider intervention.
What solved all of this was switching to a higher rated 150A/350A controller (see my sig for the details) but with heavily reduced battery current in order to keep cable and coil temperatures reasonably low and the battery happy. Startup performance is now exactly as should be expected from a motor which produces 160Nm torque at just 60A from standstill, and acceleration is nice, smooth and powerful from startup up to about 60km/h (with a little and very fun hump between 30 and 50km/h), after which the motor's back-EMF begins to kick in noticably.
As for any tradeoff I have the strange notion that my bike's charging energy consumption has actually dropped a bit since the "8kW" controller has come on board, somewhere in the region of -3%, possibly even more than -6%. Of course the better initial acceleration with a higher current than before lasts only for a few seconds at a time and then continues as before, and yet it is well possible that the higher rated mosfets in the more powerful controller create less heat due to the far lower current percentage they need to operate with. The controller housing is identical and so are the elctrical connections, which makes it readily comparable.
So no tradeoff range-wise, on the contrary if you keep your throttle at bay :-)
My rides:
2017 Zero S ZF6.5 11kW, erider Thunder 5kW
Actually, we use a 400A/120V controller on the 30 cell bike (which Aaron has); and a 300A/72V controller on the 24 cell bike. We're aware of the take off current limitation introduced by Kelly and we actually use a controller that has about twice the current capacity as we need at peak draw.
The take off accel (0 - 20) will most likely remain what it is for a while. It's not in the embarrassing range. It fits with usual take off by most car drivers - but I grant you it doesn't match impatient ones. More take-off accel is "on the list", but it's not currently "top of list" (it was at top of list earlier this year).
John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas.
Maybe the GIVI S850 Universal Holder would work for you.
http://www.scootertronics.com/givigpsholder.html
To be clear, I, and I'm sure many others, find the initial accleration to be adequate. I have yet to find an annoying impatient driver behind me unless I am deliberately acclerating slowly to conserve range. If there is a lead footed jerk behind me, he will simply have to mellow out. And at any rate, at full throttle it will be only 3 seconds before you leave that impatient driver behind.
Remember that the desire for performance without limit that has put us in this boat with regard to the environment anyway. And expressing that concern through concrete actions is the only good reason I can see for shelling out the extra money for an EV anyway.
@Derby: Thanks for the link, much appreciated.
@PJD: I agree that it is tolerable but it feels a bit underwhelming to say the least. I don't notice it being an issue at stop signs, just on four lane roads with stoplights where I can see the traffic noticeably passing me on the right or left. Not necessarily impatient drivers, just normal Midwestern traffic. I also notice it on one notable intersection close to home where the cross-traffic is 45 mph and does not have a stop sign. The underwhelming accel requires a degree of extra waiting to ensure that I can adequately get across in time well beyond either of the two vehicles (van, SUV). Well through the intersection, accel is awesome but the initial takeoff is just kind of meh. It might approach deal breaker status if I lived where there were hills but this is northern Indiana so no worries.
It is just my sense that the high errs a bit too much on the control side from takeoff. That being said, if it keeps the battery lasting longer or it is one of tires / being able to apply said torque even if it was available, I understand.
There is no way I am giving up the bike, too much fun :)
@PJD & @adstriegel:
Just to clarify on the accel issue. You most likely have different perceptions (I'm assuming you don't have actual measured data?) because:
(a) Aaron has a C130 and Paul has a C124. Aaron's bike is heavier.
(b) Having met both of you fine gentlemen my guess is that Aaron weighs more than Paul (I say this with the utmost respect ;-) )
(c) You likely have different expectations, or different responses - remember this is perceptual feedback we're currently discussing.
So, Aaron is accelerating more mass than Paul. Hence, he accelerates slower. (BTW, I misspoke earlier - both bikes have a 400A controller. We used the 300A controller on the 40Ah model which we have decided to no longer sell - this was called the C124E).
So, hey, both of you are "right"!
In conclusion:
(a) acceleration is on the list to improve but is not considered a "high priority item" at the moment.
(b) at present if acceleration is more important than range then choose the C124.
John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas.
Definitely makes sense. Thanks for the clarification John.
An additional point is simply that driving habits and perceived need for performance varies widely by region.
On a test ride on on Jackson Road outside CuMoCo's facility, I found the Michigan drivers accelerating at near full-throttle up to 60 mph, only to usually come to a halt at the next long traffic light quarter mile down the road. Driving habits are much more sedate and reasonable in Pennsylvania.
By the way, I find the performance on hills to at least 18-20 percent to be more than adequate, and on main drags, where grades are no more than 8 percent, the effect of hills on performance is barely noticeable.
I passed my MC license skills test on my C124 today (just in time for the season's first snow). Three of the license officials took great interest in the scooter, coming out to look at it and ask questions about it.
Just to renew my driving skills I took the Indiana Abate Basic Rider course on the first weekend of October. Of course I also took it to make getting the Motorcycle endorsement for my driver's license easier. In Indiana, if you take the course and pass, you do not have to demonstrate your riding skills at the BMV. But my point, from which I have strayed, is the instructors were interested in the Current Maxi-scooter that I will have soon. I promised to bring it around for them to look over when I get it (and when classes start again next spring). Their interest, I suspect, is little more than curiosity as they both drive much larger ICE cycles.
One of our existing customers is an MSF instructor. The MSF now do some basic rider courses for scooter riders (with automatic transmission). There was some interest expressed in using our bikes for that.
As Derby points out these are all motorcycle aficionados and so much of the interest is curiosity and the desire to find out more about any motorized two-wheeler. Mind you, it's all good! Thanks for taking the time to let folks see your bikes.
p.s. congrats to both Derby and PJD on taking the training and/or passing! Nothing substitutes for good training.
John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas.