I recently converted my VX-1 to lithium, working great, a lot better to ride.
I would like some input regarding battery and controller temperature. I get about a 20F rise on the batteries after a ride with 85F degree day.
I think this is ok, but the other day I blasted down the road after charging at 68MPH for about 1 mile, hard regen and returned to full speed, the over temp light came on on the dash, I slowed and checked my controller temperature with the computer after parking. I am sure it cooled a bit but had a MC temperature of 55C/ 131F at 87F ambient.
I am considering adding a fan back to the battery box, no room for the original impellers however.
Anyone have temperature issues with a conversion?
Overheating
Mon, 07/28/2014 - 16:32
#1
Overheating
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Please tell us the precise details of your conversion, most importantly, what pack voltage you have. I am wondering if it is over voltage (compared to the original) at all if this may be the problem? MW
Regards, Martin Winlow
Isle of Colonsay, Scotland
evalbum.com/2092
The conversion is 42 Thundersky 40ah batteries. I used a miniBMS and lion65 firmware in the charger.
I have a cycle analyst to monitor things.
On the day in question I had just charged and I think the voltage was close to 150.
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com
I was reading the Zero motorcycle forums elsewhere and they mentioned controller temperatures of 150F and more as the threshold for overheating. I think what you are seeing is normal under hard riding. Is it good? Can't comment on that.
riding at 68mph is very energy intensive - the MC will get hot (or rather it's heatsink will)
I suspect that the reason I managed to damage two IGBT modules internally was due to overheating by riding my vectrix at 68mph for 30mins continuous twice a day
interesting that it happened after just 1min at 68mph
I wouldn't worry about your batteries unless they're getting to 50 deg C
Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km
I had my temperature issue again, this time fresh off the charger and very cool morning driving 40mph. This seems to happen if I top off the charge and disconnect before the charger shuts off then ride, happens in a few miles. I suspect a firmware issue as it has happened after I changed firmware. I shut the bike off for about 15 seconds and no more light.
I arrived home after 47 miles and the bike won't start the charge correctly, flashing battery, temperature light and service icon at times. battery at 36c, ambient 80F
When battery got to 35c charging started normally and all icons stayed off.
Anyone have similar problems?
I may need to get a fan installed somewhere.
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com
Hi Elevatorguy,
From your posts I gather your overheating issue lies with the battery not the MC? Obviously, fixing the problem initially relies on an accurate diagnosis of the fault.
The manual says the dash 'High Temp Telltale' light (HTTL) illuminates when '…the battery or key system components exceed safe operating temperature.' Does your BMMS monitor battery temperature? I'm just wondering if the HTTL is coming on do to something else, e.g. the MC getting too hot? Maybe the MC fan isn't working?
If it is the battery, did you install the original Vectrix battery temp sensors back into the LiFePO4 battery terminal bolts? Or did you just tape them up and tuck them out the way somewhere? Obviously if it's the latter then perhaps either they are getting too hot where they are or maybe they are partially shorting or something?
If you reconnected them, does the HTTL light work in a way that tallies with any other battery temperature monitoring you have (i.e. BMMS or CA) etc?
TS cells should cause no problems with overheating either during charging or discharging due to the relatively low amps being drawn during each case.
Regards, Martin Winlow
Isle of Colonsay, Scotland
evalbum.com/2092
Hi Martin,
It started with the HTTL light then after a while the battery indicator came on. After a little bit they started to flash and the wrench lit up for a about 5 or 10 seconds and went off. I didn't get to connect to the canbus to see what was hot, I assumed battery due to flashing battery.
I have mounted the temperature sensors to the batteries, and I agree about the TS cells not getting warm under the low amp loads. It was only 100F according to the sensors, not that hot. After it cooled to charge at 10amps, it shut down early and it could have been the BMS temp sensor.
I will give it another run today and be ready to connect the computer and see what the real numbers are and if I have a hot spot at a cell (bad connection?) where a temp sensor is mounted.
I need to collect more information to sort it out, I just had wondered if anyone had a similar issue.
I will be changing firmware to a proper file and that may resolve this as well.
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com
Which firmware are you using at the moment? You say "lion65", but where's it from and what are its characteristics?
The Laird has just this week sent me a firmware file which works very well for my 42 x 40AH CALB conversion - you could ask him for something similar for yours?
The Laird is setting me up with firmware, I have lion65vm.hex which is supposed to charge at 10a until 153v then at 1.5 amps until 153v which it does. But I don't know what, if any changes have been made to anything else.
I contacted The Laird to set me up with a firmware for my setup. I may have another issue, but eliminating that variable is a start.
I hope to restore the missing dash functions as well.
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com
Battery warning light = low pack voltage. Was the pack voltage low?
"...It was only 100F according to the sensors…" What sensors and where/to what are they mounted? If you know the battery temperature is not excessive (from your other monitoring systems) and the bike is showing an over temp battery issue then clearly the bike's hardware/firmware is not woking correctly.
According to the trouble shooting guide (in the manual) ;-
1/ Flashing battery light AND flashing HTTL = battery temp > 50C OR battery temp sensor data error. You stated your cells were at 100F = 37C i.e. no-where near a battery temperature issue ergo - faulty battery temp sensor(s).
2/ Flashing battery light AND flashing HTTL AND flashing wrench = 'Battery air plenum' - whatever that means!
I think you may have a case of the old faulty temperature sensor thing. A search on VIFV for this problem may help but I think your first job is to hitch up the peak cable and see if there are any errors logged in the diagnostic software. Depending on the result of that, I'd consider trying to do away with the sensors either one at a time, all together, temporarily or permanently - I believe there is a version of the firmware that works without them connected (I may be wrong on that so don't get your hopes up). Failing that, you'll have to try and find out which sensor is defective and replace it.
Regards, Martin Winlow
Isle of Colonsay, Scotland
evalbum.com/2092
The voltage was 134.3 (CA),135v dash, 36c was temperature displayed by dash guage which is the sensors I refer to.
The HTTL coming on at random after incomplete charge leads me to the firmware, but this is all speculation at this point.
I will drive the bike to warm things up and get some readings, I don't think the errors stay logged in the software.
After I do some diagnostic work, and have proper firmware I am not ready to condemn any parts.
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com
The tests were rather uneventful, I rode for 16.5 miles at 50 MPH on a 83F day. When I charged no errors or light
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pic not working, try https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share?s=vtKMk0FiT6AgDVWmqbZxvU
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=1174
http://www.evalbum.com/preview.php?vid=4677
http://mhomoney.blogspot.com
http://Lithiumvectrix.blogspot.com