Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging Icon flashing & no ignition key needed -HELP

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DesGilmore
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Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging Icon flashing & no ignition key needed -HELP

Anyone ever have this problem with their Vectrix

I live in BELFAST, N. IRELAND & of course I’m the only VECTRIX registered in the country.

I have a 2007 VECTRIX bought June 2010 which now has about 1400 miles on it.
(Purchased with 300 miles on it)

Have got a problem with Vectrix (knew it would eventually happen!).

After a trip yesterday (9 Aug 2011), did a normal charge & came down to garage a few hours later.
Noticed that the charge seemed to have been completed OK as fans were off, but the front & rear
running lights had switched on. Key was not in the ignition. The dashboard lights were also on & the little
“electric plug” symbol icon on the left dial was flashing & also the “Ready” signal Icon.

I removed the electric charging cable but everything stayed as it was. I put the key
in the ignition, switched on but nothing happened as bike already seemed to be in a “Ready” state.
Removed key, still the same, & was able to get on bike & ride it normally without ignition key in.

Noticed when I was riding the Battery Capacity bars on right dash, which started full, lost a few bars
when accelerating but came back immediately when throttle was closed. The electric plug icon was
flashing the whole time.

So bike is now always live with no ignition key, with the front & rear lights running lights on, dash instruments on &
showing a “flashing electric plug” and the “Ready” icon.

I can still turn the headlight beam off by holding in the flasher switch for 8 seconds, but can’t switch off front &
rear sidelights or dash lights & the bike is always in the "ready " state. It looks as if the ignition is always on & ready to
go without the Key in the ignition (except for the flashing electric plug icon) This will eventually wind the battery down.

Anyone any ideas?

Lost?

kevin smith
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

sounds vey much like mine i live in england west yorkshire..
i started to charge up the other day and noticed that when i charged it up when riding off noticed it wasn't fully full i/e 3 bars off full .???????
this seemd strange then the following day red temp light and also
red batt light turnd off bike and then back on all good then same again same lights so got back home then decided to put on cherge the bike didn't like it the clock went crazy and intamitten and
so to the rest of the lights and fans didn't try to come
on and wouldn't charge and not all display keeping on with ignition off WHAT THE HELLS WRONG I JUST don't no ????????????????

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

& was able to get on bike & ride it normally without ignition key in.

Noticed when I was riding the Battery Capacity bars on right dash, which started full, lost a few bars
when accelerating but came back immediately when throttle was closed. The electric plug icon was
flashing the whole time.

Bars that bounce up and down means the charger isn't reporting anything to the CAN bus

Was this ride with or without the key in the ignition?

my bet is the MC software has crashed.

I recommend disconnecting the battery, and reconnecting (Make sure you precharge on reconnection)

That will hard reset everything.

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Bars that bounce up and down means the charger isn't reporting anything to the CAN bus

Was this ride with or without the key in the ignition?

my bet is the MC software has crashed.

I recommend disconnecting the battery, and reconnecting (Make sure you precharge on reconnection)

That will hard reset everything.

Matt


OK Thanks the ignition was off. Made no difference when I put keys in & switched on. It's as if the ignition is on
all the time. Running lights on & charging icon flashing on dash. Bike is rideable.

I had thought about disconnecting Battery but was a little concerned with the blurb in the Service Manual about
the Current Inrush Limiter. How critical is this? is the battery easy (relatively!) to disconnect?

Thanks DesG

DesG

robert93
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Current Inrush LImiter is absolutely necessary. WARNING Vectrix battery voltages ARE LETHAL!! Use every precaution you can think of, and then some. Here is some more reading on the Vectrix Battery for you, from the collaborative handbook....

http://visforvoltage.org/book/ev-collaborative-hand-books/6681

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I had thought about disconnecting Battery but was a little concerned with the blurb in the Service Manual about
the Current Inrush Limiter. How critical is this? is the battery easy (relatively!) to disconnect?

The inrush current limiter is a fancy name for a light bulb (your local hardware will have lots to choose from).

It is *very* important to use it though.

These videos show how to do it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GERbQs1k9ic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjrOaIxt_FI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iek6zLMlr5c

Its mostly geared towards a lithium conversion, so ignore all the stuff about removing the battery and the temp sensors.
In fact leave the MC wires as they are.

All you need to do is remove one of the interconnects, wait a minute, then put wire the light bulb to the two cells adjacent to the interconnect, then put the interconnect back.

it doesn't matter if there is a 7V difference between the caps and the battery, but it does if it is 70V.

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Its mostly geared towards a lithium conversion, so ignore all the stuff about removing the battery and the temp sensors.
In fact leave the MC wires as they are.

All you need to do is remove one of the interconnects, wait a minute, then put wire the light bulb to the two cells adjacent to the interconnect, then put the interconnect back.

it doesn't matter if there is a 7V difference between the caps and the battery, but it does if it is 70V.

Matt

OK Thanks Matt

Sorry for ignorance in this but a few questions as I am unfamiliar with this. Is the Interconnect you refer to the main blue Battery connector? Exactly where do you place the light bulb wires to dissipate the current? I take it's not across the terminals of the blue connector as I thought this only seriesed the two battery halves? Is it between the red & black main connector at the rearmost of battery

DesG

DesG

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

The interconnects are the silver things that bolts to each cell

So basically you pull the two blue connectors apart

Then you unbolt one of the interconnects (it doesn't really matter which one, though choosing one where the temp sensors aren't bolted to is easiest)

Put a light globe across that connection.

reconnect the two blue connectors (with the light globe still attached).
The light globe will glow for a moment.

Then bolt the silver interconnect back in place (with the light globe still in circuit).

After that you are done.

I will make a short video of the process, as this comes up relatively often (the process is the same for both lithium and nimh batteries)

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km

kevin smith
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

hi matt lookforward to seeing the video .
as i as having probblems at the moment red light on temp and also battery aswell.??
and not charging and all dash keeping on even with the keys on/ out of the ignition i am puzzeld to hell .
but with whats been said sounds like batterys need to disconected and then reconnected????
but may be somthing more serious like battery / cell bullging or sensor gone ?
thanks hope someone cane help i live in leeds england.

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Hi Kevin,

I will be away from hoem for the next 3 weeks, so won't be able to make the video until I am back.

If you have access to a usb-CAN cable, you can try re-flashing the MC, charger and ICM.

That may sort your problem out.

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Hi Kevin,

I stripped down bike on Saturday night. (Was easier than I thought! So Far! )

I got to battery, disconnected & did the “re-set” successfully using a 40W bulb as
an ICL. (Current Limiter) This worked fine. Battery voltage had dropped to 128v with the lights being on for 5 days. Anyway re-connected battery & this cleared the lights-on fault.

Tried the ignition & everything seemed to be working. Tried engine with bike on centre stand
& it worked OK. All seemed clear. But noticed that under a little engine load the Battery bars
on dash were still bouncing as I revved up a little more load. Not good!.

Then tried to do a re-charge. Everything worked fine & bike started charging. The input
charge rate on the Speedometer seemed a little higher than the usual I had observed before,
but not significantly so.

The 1st time I did this re-charge it stopped charging after about 4 minutes, then the lights turned on as before and the bike became live with “Ready flashing” and “drivable” without any ignition keys. Same as before.

I then went thru this process a few more times after “re-sets” with exactly the same result,
except that the time it actually “charged for” came down to about 1 minute before it stopped & “lights on – engine live” condition.

So basically I’m in the same position I was last week & searching for more information on the problem.

DesG

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Hi Matt,

Excellent instructive Videos! Here's my results:

I stripped down bike on Saturday night. (Was easier than I thought! So Far! )

I got to battery, disconnected & did the “re-set” successfully using a 40W bulb as
an ICL. (Current Limiter) This worked fine. Battery voltage had dropped to 128v with the lights being on for 5 days.
Anyway re-connected battery & this cleared the lights-on fault.

Tried the ignition & everything seemed to be working. Tried engine with ignition key, with bike on centre stand
& it worked OK. All seemed clear. But noticed that under a little engine load the Battery bars
on dash were still bouncing as I revved up a little more load. Not good!.

Then I tried to do a re-charge. Everything worked fine & bike started charging. The input
charge rate on the Speedometer seemed a little higher than the usual I had observed before,
but not significantly so.

The 1st time I did this re-charge it stopped charging after about 4 minutes, then the lights turned on as before and the bike became live with “Ready flashing” and “drivable” without any ignition keys. Same as before.

I then went thru this process a few more times after “re-sets” with exactly the same result,
except that the time it actually “charged for” came down to about 1 minute before it stopped & “lights on – engine live” condition and charger icon flashing.

So basically I’m in the same position I was last week, a little further into the problem, thanks to you, & searching for more information on it.

Any ideas as to the next step.

DesG

DesG

tt-tronix
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I had a partly similar problem. My ESD charger failed (possibly due to heat problems - I found a not soldered interconnection in the charger in the fan control circuit -> timebomb). When I started to charge the dashboard made its init procedure, the fans started running and after a few seconds the charging process stopped with lights on and in ready flashing mode - but only for a few seconds. Then the whole procedure started again and again.

So maybe the charger is the problem!?

Best regards
Tido

kevin smith
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

hi des ouch sounds simlar to me hope we can sort out our great scooters .soon.
kev

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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Kev - try www.emissionsfree.co.uk/

They're the new UK importer and are servicing Vectrix. I've been in touch with Dave there, who's been very helpful. They use Doug Townley, I believe, who worked for Vectrix UK with Steve Scott.

Not sure about the Irish situation, though there are two dealers on the Vectrix website: http://www.mcc-controls.com/web/ and http://www.greenmachines.ie/

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I had a partly similar problem. My ESD charger failed (possibly due to heat problems - I found a not soldered interconnection in the charger in the fan control circuit -> timebomb). When I started to charge the dashboard made its init procedure, the fans started running and after a few seconds the charging process stopped with lights on and in ready flashing mode - but only for a few seconds. Then the whole procedure started again and again.

So maybe the charger is the problem!?

Best regards
Tido

Hi Tido,
How did you solve this problem. Did you remove charger?
Des G

DesG

DesGilmore
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

Kev - try www.emissionsfree.co.uk/

They're the new UK importer and are servicing Vectrix. I've been in touch with Dave there, who's been very helpful. They use Doug Townley, I believe, who worked for Vectrix UK with Steve Scott.

Not sure about the Irish situation, though there are two dealers on the Vectrix website: http://www.mcc-controls.com/web/ and http://www.greenmachines.ie/

OK Thanks Kev I will try emissions free & green machines

DesG

tt-tronix
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I simply bought a new charger - the EVPS Charger / "Runkie" Charger because the repair of the old one failed and ended with a loud "BANG"... It is VERY difficult to disassemble the ESD-Charger! It is designed as a "throw-away-part" :-(

Tido

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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I have a similar problem in that my 2007 vectrix simply is dead. When plugging it in there is no life at all. What should I chekc first?

Vectrix43

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I have a similar problem in that my 2007 vectrix simply is dead. When plugging it in there is no life at all. What should I chekc first?

I would check the battery voltage - if the bike doesn't turn on at all, chances are your battery is below 100v

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah in July 2010. Done 194'000km

R
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

I agree with master antiscab, the internal computer is always turned on and drains energy from the battery.
If the vectrix is not recharged every month, it empties below 100v. At 80+V the main computer turns off to save energy, then the energy is only drained (I suspect) by the temperature main boards (in NIMH versions, your vectrix is nickel?). If the battery is not recharged for a long period of time, you'll find your battery hanging around 30v.

Check the battery voltage. You don't need to disassemble the main cover, just unplug the DC connector of the charger and check with a tester, in some versions the plugs are accessible from the hole of the fork.

If voltage is low, Just raise up the voltage to over 100v DC with a suitable device and your vectrix will turn on again. Be careful with the voltage...

X Vectrix
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Re: Vectrix Problem with no charging/ Lights on / Charging ...

R
A slight clarification. The drain on older MCs is due to the input bias circuit internally on the DC/DC converter. None of the logic on any of the control boards stay powered up when the key is off. Under about 80V input, 2 things can happen: the DC/DC will not turn on anymore and the battery charger will not supply current. Both require the battery to be boosted.

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