Anyone going to the auction?

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dexion
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Anyone going to the auction?

Is anyone going to in person go to the auction? I'll start out by saying if anyone is I'd be willing id pay for in person help arranging shipping/verifying voltages/bike starts moves that sort of thing as would perhaps others. I'd like to bid on 2 vx-1 lithiums provided they start and there is an mco (ie we can register the bike) and two full sets of replacement batteries a controller and charger or two. I'm going to contact the auction house Monday to see if they arrange shipping for a fee but I'd doubt they would check voltages on a pack or perhaps may not even start a bike for us. It just would be better to have someone there in person.

JimmyB
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I'd love to go, at least in theory. In practice I'm not sure I can get the time of work, it's a long way, etc etc etc.

Let me know what further info you get out of the auction house though, it could well be worth collaborating to keep the stuff that's worth saving in the hands of the community.

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Same here! I'd like to go and have a good chance that I will - I have a daughter in college in the Boston area, so the trip would be a good combo. I'm in the DC area (in MD), near where JimmyB is (and MD Bob too, an I know of one more person near me). So between the 4 of us, I think we may have at least one going ;)

I don't know if I'll buy anything though - depends on prices. I would not mind a new bike if the price is right, as I think a scooter is the right form factor for me. I would not mind to inspect/pick-up for others, but transporting more than 1 bike might be more than I can do - my car can hardly pull one bike on a trailer, so if I do buy one, I might need to rent a one-way truck, which gets expensive in terms of gas/diesel for a 500 mile trip...

Anyway, let's stay in touch and see who's going and what help we can offer each other.

dexion
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Got some more info but it still feels like it would be best if someone can go in person and at least verify a bike starts or voltage on loose batts.
Most are wait until the catalog is posted in about two weeks and all will be revealed answers (which is perfectly fine.)

Paul, I was wondering if you could answer a few questions for me.

Is there any way to get a voltage on the battery packs (and are they lifep04 or nickel) that are loose (or cell voltages) im going to be remote unfortunately. ----- I will speak to the former employee who is doing consulting work for us. I am confident we will be able to get you them. We are still in the very early stages of getting the place ready for a sale and haven't really gone through large groups of batteries to get specs yet. My guess is 2 weeks we will have all information and a catalog up online.

Do the bikes have an MCO (are able to be registered) and can we tell if they actually start (ie voltage is over 100volts on the pack) ------- We will make all the registration announcements prior to sale or on the catalog. The VX-2 bikes are brand new in box and will not be tested. There are several on the floor that I know start and I will make sure they are described as such in the catalog.

What are the terms of removal (sorry I couldn’t find them on the site) as ill need to arrange shipping.----- We will have information on riggers and full removal terms when the catalog gets posted. My guess is they will give buyers a minimum of a week to get items out of the facility. Keys need to be turned over to the landlord on July 1st. I will keep you posted on all fronts.
Thanks

JimmyB
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Dexion, thanks for posting those answers from Paul, it's really helpful.

I guess we wait until the catalog comes out. I might investigate the cost of a one-way U-Haul ... :D

RobertK
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Took the day off

Hoping I can big on one VX-2 for short money. I own one and love it but the speedometer is reading "system Error 1" now. Manual says replace. might be cheaper just to buy a 2012 and use the 2011 as parts. Too bad they went under. Still hoping someone buys everything and opens again. Looks like all the parts are being sold off as single lots. I don't have the storage room to do that so one bike should do.

RobertK
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Just took the day off hoping to pick up one VX-2 doe short money. I own one and need some parts............... don't have the space to buy an aisle of parts, they are being sold as a lot. Might not have the time to view, so I just looked on line. Allot of VX-2's in boxes.

Fixit
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Hi there, the auction
There are no running Vx1 scooters all you see on web site, pesco.com, have no batteries
There are about 65 Vx2 scooters running with lead acid and will supplied with MCO
THERE ARE NO COMPLETE FUNCTIONAL BATTERIES FOR VX1
Plenty of tools and test equipment, motorcycle ramps etc
Good luck!

Galago
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Dear Santa, I would like a new Vx-1 frame please. ((have some $))
Sincerely, Galago

PaulC1234
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

On Wednesday June 18, 2014, Paul Saperstein Co., Inc. will be selling all assets of Vectrix LLC in New Bedford, MA. Highlights include: (75) Complete Vectrix All Electric VX1, VX2 & VX3 Motorcycles & Scooters, Approx. 100 New Lithium Ion Bike Batteries, 1.6 Million Dollars worth of Bike Parts and raw material, Bike Lifts, Alignment Machines, Handling Equipment, Office Furniture, Electronics, and Much More.

Please go to http://www.pesco.com/servlet/SelectAuction.do?auctionId=9256&path=/servlet/AuctionInfo.do for full catalog and registration instructions or contact me at pcotto [at] pesco.com.

Inspection: Tuesday, June 17th 9 AM to 3:30 PM. Case #14-11381-WCH, Warren Agin, Trustee, Swiggart & Agin, Boston, MA.

PaulC1234
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

On Wednesday June 18, 2014, Paul Saperstein Co., Inc. will be selling all assets of Vectrix LLC in New Bedford, MA. Highlights include: (75) Complete Vectrix All Electric VX1, VX2 & VX3 Motorcycles & Scooters, Approx. 100 New Lithium Ion Bike Batteries, 1.6 Million Dollars worth of Bike Parts and raw material, Bike Lifts, Alignment Machines, Handling Equipment, Office Furniture, Electronics, and Much More.

Please go to http://www.pesco.com/servlet/SelectAuction.do?auctionId=9256&path=/servlet/AuctionInfo.do for full catalog and registration instructions or contact me at pcotto [at] pesco.com.

Inspection: Tuesday, June 17th 9 AM to 3:30 PM. Case #14-11381-WCH, Warren Agin, Trustee, Swiggart & Agin, Boston, MA.

gln103
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I'm hoping to attend the Vectrix auction. My goal is either to buy a full VX1 with Lithium batteries or buy a Lithium battery pack and charger to upgrade my NiMH VX1.

Does anyone know if they're auctioning off either of these (full Li scooter or conversion parts) and how I can identify them?

Thanks,

Gary

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I'm hoping to buy the same - either a complete VX1 (looks like there is a full "lot" of them offered, but not individual ones as far as I can tell). I do not see Li batteries offered at all in the listings, though there are mentioned in the general description of the auction. There is one listing with two black round buckets of Li batteries but they don't look like they would be full with the ones in the Li Vectrix.

I would also want to get a winter screen and possibly replacement wheels and some other odds and ends. But all that stuff is listed as "lots", such as a whole shelf with stuff and it is not clear exactly what's included...

Some of the desk chargers might be of interest too.

Does anyone know how the pricing will work? If no one buys at a suggested opening bid, will they lower the price like they might on some auto auctions? Or let it not sell, then a liquidator will buy everything at close to no cost and then try to offload it somehow?

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I'm in MA, will check what's available tomorrow morning. If someone here wants to know anything specific, post here and I'll try to reply tomorrow if I can find an answer, so you can make-up your mind to bid online or not...

geomoo
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I wasn't sure whether to start a new thread for this, so I'll post here first, hoping someone notices.

I listened to the auction today. Before the individual lots were bid on, someone bid, I think, $280,000 for everything other than office equipment, etc., including intellectual property, bikes, and parts. Then they spent several hours in the bidding process (during which time I won the bid for the only VX1 with a lithium battery, a 2009 with no bill of origin or title. I did this not knowing whether there is a way to get around this problem and register it. Reading this thread makes me think that this is called an MCO and may be an insurmountable problem.) Anyway, it all goes back to DO NOT PASS GO, DO NOT COLLECT YOUR BIKE, because the total of the individual bids did not come close to matching the offer for everything, so everything went to the single bidder. Here's hoping this means that someone is interested in reviving the company.

It was announced that the buyer would entertain offers for some of the items. I am in Vermont now, easy striking distance of New Bedford, and I hope to talk with him tomorrow.

Incidentally, someone expressed interest in a frame, and one of the lots was various frames--not sure if there is a VX1 in there, but I can ask if you like.

I own a VX1 which has performed admirably, but a haul across country and storage in frigid temperatures seems to have wrecked the battery pack. Would it be easy for someone to tell me what I would need to do my own upgrade to a lithium plus? I think it's a different MC. Are any of the following batteries, which were listed in the lots, the batteries for a lithium or lithium plus VX 1: LiMn GP411, LiMn204, or AM28?

I am confused how to proceed with my bike. I'm willing to educate myself and do the work, but I'm not sure whether I'm better off trying to get the factory upgrade or merely trying to get in a new battery pack (hopefully li) to use with the original MC and other parts.

I assumed there would be discussion of this auction going on here. I am very curious about who bought everything and what their intentions are. It would be terrific if it were someone open to getting input from this community.

Hanging on by my fingernails, technically speaking.

geomoo
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I wasn't sure whether to start a new thread for this, so I'll post here first, hoping someone notices.

I listened to the auction today. Before the individual lots were bid on, someone bid, I think, $280,000 for everything other than office equipment, etc., including intellectual property, bikes, and parts. Then they spent several hours in the bidding process (during which time I won the bid for the only VX1 with a lithium battery, a 2009 with no bill of origin or title. I did this not knowing whether there is a way to get around this problem and register it. Reading this thread makes me think that this is called an MCO and may be an insurmountable problem.) Anyway, it all goes back to DO NOT PASS GO, DO NOT COLLECT YOUR BIKE, because the total of the individual bids did not come close to matching the offer for everything, so everything went to the single bidder. Here's hoping this means that someone is interested in reviving the company.

It was announced that the buyer would entertain offers for some of the items. I am in Vermont now, easy striking distance of New Bedford, and I hope to talk with him tomorrow.

Incidentally, someone expressed interest in a frame, and one of the lots was various frames--not sure if there is a VX1 in there, but I can ask if you like.

I own a VX1 which has performed admirably, but a haul across country and storage in frigid temperatures seems to have wrecked the battery pack. Would it be easy for someone to tell me what I would need to do my own upgrade to a lithium plus? I think it's a different MC. Are any of the following batteries, which were listed in the lots, the batteries for a lithium or lithium plus VX 1: LiMn GP411, LiMn204, or AM28?

I am confused how to proceed with my bike. I'm willing to educate myself and do the work, but I'm not sure whether I'm better off trying to get the factory upgrade or merely trying to get in a new battery pack (hopefully li) to use with the original MC and other parts.

I assumed there would be discussion of this auction going on here. I am very curious about who bought everything and what their intentions are. It would be terrific if it were someone open to getting input from this community.

Hanging on by my fingernails, technically speaking.

Jeff Spooner
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Geomoo-

I followed the auction most of the day, but didn't understand what the outcome was until you explained it. I waited all day hoping for the Lithium VX-1's, & then the auction ended? I'm glad I didn't drive 4 1/2 hours for this. Anyway I did almost bid on the (1)2009 VX-1 too. Basically I'm in a similar situation. I purchase a VX-1 fall 2012, it ran nice with about 30-35 miles range. Then following a very cold winter my Vectrix wouldn't charge (should have store in cellar not in the garage). I did charge it a few times with solar panels, but the battery capacity was real low, maybe a 4-5 miles. Anyway I'd like to convert it to Lithium & wish I had done more homework prior to the auction.

Does anyone know yet if & when VX-1's or parts will be available? Thanks.

rEVolution Rocks

hempev
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

I can only speak to my plans as to lithium and what has already been discussed here: it appears a pack of 18s1p of LEAF cells would fit easily in the battery compartment, handle the 152V end-of-charge well, with the only drawback being a loss of regen for a few mi/km until the voltage drops to 147. The supplier I have contacted sells the 7.6V/60ah modules used for ~$110 plus shipping, new ones for ~$125. A 136.8V/60ah pack that weighs 70lbs less than the NiMH version for ~$2200 sounds perfect...on paper...

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

The folks who bid the $280K for most of Vectrix today assured me that they will be very willing to sell parts and the remaining bikes. It was not clear at what prices. Timing-wise, it probably will take at least a few days as they explained they can't touch anything until the $280K gets in the hands of the auctioneers. There may also be some options about the 80 boxes of Li batteries, if the bidder on them is successful in negotiating with these folks. And all that is likely to take a few days because the funds are apparently coming from overseas. I hope the buyers/bidders will soon chime-in themselves on this topic here...

Even on-site it was very difficult to tell if a bike was complete or not or in good working order. The Li VX1 reported it had a bad cell, though it would start fine otherwise. Only three of the VX 1 and one VX 3 were charged and would power-up but there is no way to tell how good their batteries were. The rest were without batteries, although dozens of them looked like complete new bikes otherwise.

I also saw a handful of the prototype VT bikes (with larger wheels, wider swing arm, and a different motor) which looked awesome. Pity they were not completed...

gln103
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Guys,

I made the 8 hour drive to the Vectrix Auction with the same goal as others (buy a VX1 or buy the Lithium upgrade). It was a REALLY nice facility. They had all kinds of stuff there, and it looked like they literally just stopped work and walked out the door. All of the typically day-to-day stuff was on the white boards (gave you some insight into what they were doing), unfinished bikes/components were on the assembly lines, etc. It was a great experience to see that all, even considering our purchases were null and void due to the entirety bid.

Some semi-good news is the entirety bid was by 2 (young) guys from Vectrix's Poland and Italy facilities. They plan to move everything to Poland and re-open Vectrix. Unknown what that means for the USA side of the world.

As for the Lithium packs, the two main lots were GP411 LiMN204 cells (presumably from Gold Peak) in arrangements of ~6-7 cells held together. No interconnects, no electronics, no BMS, basically just cells. I couldn't tell if they were 30 or 42 Ahr.

There were also semi-finished "AM28" batteries who's cells were physically different than the GP411 batteries. Some of these had electronics (BMS), mounting, housings, and all the peripheral stuff. Some did not. My feeling on these was, unless you knew exactly what these were and how to use them (ie: you're a former Vectrix employee, it would be nearly impossible to have these be a plug-and-play replacement in your VX1).

Lastly, there were no details on what charger changes need made to implement these lithium batteries.

All in all, a very educational day, but not fruitful for getting my VX1 converted to lithium. So, I'm still in the market should anyone know of a good lithium conversion.

Gary

kingcharles
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Great news if Vectrix can somehow continue, these great bikes are EV history and should be kept on the road as long as possible.

I hope the Polish guys do well and if they are smart they make a Leaf Vectrix kit. And they should complete all remaining chassis with the Leaf cells.

So the IP is also included in the one bid?
I would have expected the multi function throttle to have some interest from Zero or BMW and could have raised perhaps more money?

Once you go EV, Gas is history!

geomoo
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Thanks for the good info, everyone.

As to acquiring the IP separately, it would have cost at least more than $280,000.

Does it make sense for us as a group to discuss what items in the factory might be crucial in keeping our VX-1's on the road long term? Perhaps we could find a way to pool together and purchase some parts. I'm pretty certain, for example, that there were gear boxes as well as body parts. I'm wondering if in the next couple of days we could come up with enough interest and money to do something with an eye toward keeping these on the road.

It's hard to imagine these two guys using these meager supplies to get back up and running, and they will be facing an enormous PR problem. They will certainly need significant money, and now the competition is much more fierce. Here's hoping they do it. Seeing the wonderful Vectrix design implemented well would be deeply satisfying.

Hanging on by my fingernails, technically speaking.

geomoo
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

This was a double comment, so I edited it down to this.

Hanging on by my fingernails, technically speaking.

R
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Some semi-good news is the entirety bid was by 2 (young) guys from Vectrix's Poland and Italy facilities. They plan to move everything to Poland and re-open Vectrix.

That makes sense. They've split vectrix into two independent companies, USA and Europe. USA Vectrix kept the debt and filled chapter. Vectrix Europe has just re-bought the USA parts to bring them back to Europe. Wonderful news, no doubt, the Vx-1 is a masterpiece of engineering (apart from the damned batteries) that deserves to live again!
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Then following a very cold winter my Vectrix wouldn't charge (should have store in cellar not in the garage)

Storing in cellar would have made no difference.
I don't understand why vectrix never gave storing instructions in the owners manual. Internal vectrix's computer is always turned on. It drains the battery. Vectrix should be stored plugged in with a weekly timer, to recharge some minutes per week to maintain voltage. if you just plug in without any timer, it only recharges one time, and the battery is drained, and damaged. The easiest option you have is to replace the worst NIMH cells with good NIMH cells.
Jeff Spooner
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Thanks for the input. Since I did charge several times over that winter (up to full capacity) to try to protect the battery, I'm still of the belief that something failed do to the cold. Or as you say some marginal cells may have gone completely bad? Until I learn about the workings & tear it down I'll never know. Great to here about the possibility of using Leaf cells! Now wondering if Th!nk EV cells could be utilized (fun little car I drive :)

rEVolution Rocks

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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

There were enough spare parts for years of support, probably enough to finish the remaining dozens of NiMh VX-1 bikes, even if they converted to Li (there were tons of BMS modules, chargers, motor controllers, wiring, etc. and probably 500 Li cells in boxes). I think the batteries were the 30ah variety (had a 30 in the name, not sure).

The other lots with assembled and lose Li modules with BMS and the cells mentioned in the above post that were not for VX-1 I was told by an x-vectrix employee (yes, the XVectrix) were for the VT bikes that were never put in production. As were the helical planetary gears (quiet with no whine, anyone?).

As for pooling money to buy parts, unless someone has a warehouse and is willing to manage them, I don't see how it would work. Unless we each say what we need, pool our money, buy the lot, then immediately split according to what each paid for - so no need for someone to manage the parts. I'd be good for a front fork (or shocks), brake pads, a set of tires, winter screen, mirrors, a spare ESD charger, wheel bearings - but would not pay more than $400 for that set. Or just get the VX-1 that I won ;)

As for registering the bikes, can someone explain what the issue is? I thought they would come with MCO (manufacturer certificate of origin) and the department of motor vehicles should be able to title them, no? Worst-case, I can do some morphing and transform my old VX-1 into my new one so it is already titled and registered (basically move all new parts to the old frame with the old VIN).

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

As for the "New Vectrix", post bankruptcy, unless they come-up with new models on a simplified architecture (especially the electronics), they will have no chance. I saw what goes into each Vectrix, and I can assure you it is more than what I think goes into the Zero motorcycles. By more, I mean more parts and components - the Vectrix is expensive to make and maintain, with quite a few known failure points. I rode the Zero models recently - they feel solid and ride great, they look bare-bones and have very few parts. The Vectrix is way over-complicated in comparison (and in ways that don't necessarily achieve any tangible benefits for the rider, just rack-up costs and create potential failure points). And the new V would need to be simpler and also made more flexible in terms of management software and connectivity with phones/GPS, etc.

Also, for each maxi scooter I see dozens of street bikes on the road todsy - the concept of a maxi scooter is unpopular in the US. Most people who would buy a small displacement motorcycle or scooter do so to save money and to not need a full motorcycle license. You don't save money with a a VX-1, you do need a full motorcycle license and insurance, and what you get is slower and harsher-riding compared to a full-size bike like the Zero. For me (for daily commuting and errands running) a maxi scooter form factor is better than a bare-bones bike like the Zero. But if it is going to costs the same as a road bike, it would need to offer much more than it does today. Vectrix, to survive in the US, I am guessing needs to develop a solid motorcycle line as a main revenue stream (unless VX-2 like small scooters can make up in sales volume). I don't think they can sell enough VX-1 type of scooters at a profitable price, unless they really reengineer them to be cheaper to make and offer a lot more then they do today.

Vectrix has a lot more potential in Europe where relatively expensive scooters (compared to gas equivalents) are a much more viable proposition than in the US and probably the rest of the world. But will they make enough to justify a US distribution? Doubt it, unless they really change how they do business and improve the quality of the batteries and battery management to minimize warranty work.

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Did anyone who bid/won at the auction hear back from the entirety bid winners regarding honoring their individual bids? My emails to them from last week remain unanswered so far ...

geomoo
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Good discussion and info, Kocho. Bad news on the bidders, of course. They failed to meet the conditions. I just received an email from the auctioneer giving me 24 hours to decide whether to buy the 2009 VX-1 lithium that I won the bid for at $1500. I'm wondering whether I should do it. The idea is to have plenty of back-up parts (different color, sadly) and to have a lithium battery. The discussions here and elsewhere on this website have me thinking I should fix my battery or do an upgrade to a lithium on my 2007, then just move on to a different brand when it gets too expensive to maintain. Any thoughts on this? And I wonder what they will do with the items that were won in bids but that the bidders choose not to buy now. Typical Vectrix mess and a perfect way to go out.

It seemed to me that different bidders won the various lots of Vectrix parts, which I found to be strange. I hope we can find out who these bidders are and what their intentions are. In theory, it should be helpful to both parties to connect and sell the parts that people want to actually use in motorcycles. I can't quite imagine why people bought these lots, unless there is some way to recycle and make a profit.

Hanging on by my fingernails, technically speaking.

Kocho
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Re: Anyone going to the auction?

Only you can decide if it is worth it for you to get the Li for $1,500... When I checked it out, it reported one low cell, but looked good otherwise as much as one can tell from just looking at it on the floor. Weather only one cell is damaged or just needs s good charging and equalization, or if there are more cells with an issue is anyone's guess, unfortunately. On the other hand, if it just needs s few cells, that's easy and you get a new bike for less than the price of a battery alone.

I too just got a call from them asking me kf I want my bike or not. I will take it. I won a white NiMh VX-1 for $900 and for me it seems like it would be worth it, especially if its battery is better than mine. But even if for parts only and as a platform for a Li upgrade later, I'd get it if they'd give it to me. I am reluctant to invest in a full new Li upgrade for my old '07 bike with 11K miles, but on a virtually new one I would do it, so that's my plan for it. If I ever get it, I'll se...

I spoke with Piotr this morning and we will talk again later today. Looks like the Dutch investors backed out and did not pay. He mentioned he bought some lots with VX-1s and parts. I don't know what to make of it and how to reconcile with that you got a note about buying your Li VX-1... We did not discuss his plans for Vectrix, but hope he will offer some support in the future - why else buy all that inventory?

I asked the auctioneers today if, along with my bike, I could pickup some spare parts too. They will have an answer for me on Thursday. I'll keep you posted. So far, the plan is for me to go get my bike at the least, and possibly some spare parts if Piotr does not get them all.

If I can be of any help while I'm there (likely Friday or over the weekend this week), let me know. I will drive to MA and back from the DC area and maybe able to meet you there or along the way. Unless we gang-up with someone here to hire a larger truck/van/trailer, I will only be able to bring small stuff with me as my car can barely deal with one motorcycle on a small trailer. Renting a van and paying for gas for it will come to probably $400-500, while renting a motorcycle trailer for my car will be cheaper, especially if I can get it one-way from UHaul in MA like I have been able to do on previous occasions from elsewhere...

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