battery upgrade for the clueless

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millea1
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battery upgrade for the clueless

Howdy,

I have an HCF pacelite 707 and I'd like to upgrade the battery to get a little more range. The spec says it has DC24V 10AH Max 350W Lead-acid X 2 cells.

Am looking at the YESA LiFePO4 electric bike Scooter battery 24V 10Ah on e-bay. My question is, since the lead-acid is 2 cells, I assume I need 2 of the 24V LiFePO4 batteries; is that true?

Also, having never messed with scooter batteries, et. al. Is this going to be a time-consuming replacement effort first time around?

Thanks for your help,
Allen

LinkOfHyrule
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

No. There's two SLA (lead acid) batteries in the thing becuase they're in series to get 24V. The lithium pack is already 24V.

It shouldn't be too time consuming, especially since there will be loads of extra room in the battery box. The part that will take the longest is redoing the connectors to the controller and charger.

You'll want to take a look at the basics section on this site. They'll help you understand what we're talking about. They'll also help you understand the relationships bewtween V, Ah, different chemistries, etc.

Also, you should be seeing at least a 50% increase in range with the new batteries. :)

The author of this post isn't responsible for any injury, disability or dismemberment, death, financial loss, illness, addiction, hereditary disease, or any other undesirable consequence or general misfortune resulting from use of the "information" contai

NickF23
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

The other important thing when selecting batteries is the discharge rate. Make sure the continuous and peak discharge rates (measured in amps) specified by the battery are lower than the continous and peak current draw demanded by your motor.

chas_stevenson
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

The other important thing when selecting batteries is the discharge rate. Make sure the continuous and peak discharge rates (measured in amps) specified by the battery are lower than the continuous and peak current draw demanded by your motor.

I think Nick really wanted to say ;
The other important thing when selecting batteries is the discharge rate. Make sure the continuous and peak discharge rates (measured in amps) specified by the battery are Higher than the continuous and peak current draw demanded by your motor.

Grandpa Chas S.

dogman
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

couldn't agree more to that. lipo4 rocks but make sure you buy a batt that can send the juice to the controller. nice thing abot yesa's is you aren't stuck with jut one if the discharge rate is low.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

millea1
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

Thanks guys, this gets me started in the right direction...one other thing if I May.

Is there an easy way to find out the continuous and peak current draw demanded by the motor? Haven't seen anything on the net yet (or on the hcf site), and don't have a manual. Is there some way to tell by examining the motor cover?

Thanks again for the help...

andrew
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

The continuous current should be less then what the motor is rated for. At 350 watts, this would be about 437.5 watts input (figuring 80% efficiency) divided by 24v = 18.23 amps. It is difficult to calculate what the peak current would be and that depends on the controller limit.

You could install an amp meter to measure it. Automotive amp meters are cheap.

[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/587-my-kz750-electric-motorcycle-project]KZ750 Motorcycle Conversion[/url]
[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/588-fixing-my-chinese-scooter]900 watt scooter[/url]
Pic from http://www.electri

chas_stevenson
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

Just a note for clarification;
The motor is not the controlling factor when you are talking about amp draw. The Controller is what regulates current flow. If you connect the motor, even a 350-watt motor, directly to the batteries it could draw well over 100 amps. Remember the motor is just a long piece of wire with very little resistance. If you had a long piece of wire and connected each end to the opposite sides of a battery you would have a short and the battery would release as many amps as possible. These motors have less than .1 ohms of resistance so if you have a 36-volt power source connected to a .1 ohm resistor then the current flow would be 360 amps assuming the power source could supply that many amps. Even the standard UB12120, 12-volt 12 AH, battery can discharge at 100 amps for 5 seconds as shown "here".

Grandpa Chas s.

dogman
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

yup even an agriculture major like me can understand why they call it a controller. but now i'm curious, can you run an automotive amp meter on 36, or 48 volts without frying it? that would be cool to have that info without spending a lot of bucks for a higher rated amp meter. junkyards are backyards here.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

chas_stevenson
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

dogman,

We have lots of newbies here so I just wanted to make sure everyone was working from the same sheet of music as it were.

I don't know about you but I am a bit on the lazy side so I look for the easy solutions. Your idea to use a 12v automotive meter is doable but not without some work, "work" is a 4 letter word. I would suggest a look on eBay to see what you can find. In just a few seconds I found this Golf Cart 36V 36 Volt Battery Meter. I just did a search for "36 volt meter" you might also try "48 volt meter" and see what you get.

Good Luck,
Grandpa Chas S.

NickF23
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

I think Nick really wanted to say ;
The other important thing when selecting batteries is the discharge rate. Make sure the continuous and peak discharge rates (measured in amps) specified by the battery are Higher than the continuous and peak current draw demanded by your motor.

Grandpa Chas S.

ooops

he's he did mean that.

Thanks Chas

andrew
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

Your idea to use a 12v automotive meter is doable but not without some work, "work" is a 4 letter word.

I didn't mean to use an automotive volt meter, but an amp meter. Like this: Harbor Freight - IN-DASH AMPERE METER

An amp meter is really a volt meter that measures the voltage across a calibrated resistor. That voltage measured only varies with current flow. So the amp meter should work fine in a higher voltage circuit in theory. At least it's not much money spent if it fries.

[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/587-my-kz750-electric-motorcycle-project]KZ750 Motorcycle Conversion[/url]
[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/588-fixing-my-chinese-scooter]900 watt scooter[/url]
Pic from http://www.electri

Mik
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

I didn't mean to use an automotive volt meter, but an amp meter. Like this: Harbor Freight - IN-DASH AMPERE METER

An amp meter is really a volt meter that measures the voltage across a calibrated resistor. That voltage measured only varies with current flow. So the amp meter should work fine in a higher voltage circuit in theory. At least it's not much money spent if it fries.

How do these amp meters get connected?

Could I attach one to one of the battery cables of my Scootux to get real time info on power consumption and regen braking effectiveness?

Mr. Mik

This information may be used entirely at your own risk.

There is always a way if there is no other way!

dogman
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Re: battery upgrade for the clueless

cool! where I live there should be a free car ampmeter laying about in a relatives backyard. I totally agree about work, i wasn't going to look since i thought one would fry. real time amps info will help tell me when to stop frying my hub on the big hill coming home. of course i really should just buy one of the really good products out there if i really want to know how the electrons or flowing. the only way to wire it i would know about would be running the positive wire through it on the way to the motor, but maybe that method would fry it. i'm clueless what's involved with the way a cycleanalyst does it. thanks all for the info it really helps though ive been known to ignore it and do what i feel is right. guys like me get pretty used to steep learning curves and buying everyting twice. had to rewire the insides of my first we hub after five minuites use. i thought the bolts were as tight as i dared on a chinese nut. not tight enough.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

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