X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

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deadmanwins
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X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Hi everyone, I'm new to these forums and have been researching inexpensive electric scooters.

I think I've narrowed my choices down to an X-treme Scooters XB-700Li or an AER E-800.

I've found a lot of good information on the XB-700Li and find it to have many appealing features at a great price. However, I do have concerns about build quality.

The AER E-800 appears to be built by Mountain Chen and looks like a downsized Zapino for half the price. A dealer in my area carries it and I would probably buy from him.

Any thoughts on which direction I should go?

I appreciate and value your input. :)

Jerry
Loveland, CO

reikiman
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

You mean... http://www.smallplanetearth.com/bikesinfo.php?id=21 ???

I see an advantage that you can go to this shop and inspect it directly and if there's problems you can go to the dealer directly.

andys
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

I believe Mountain Chen makes the Xtreme scooter as well, so I don't know why the build quality would be better on either of them. At least on the Xtreme you get Lithium batteries instead of lead acid.

deadmanwins
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Yes, going with Small Earth has the advantage of being able to look the scooter over before I buy, as well as being able to have their help with any problems.

The AER scooter has silicon batteries. As I've researched the lithium ion vs silicon battery issue I've found that both will last longer than the lead-acid batteries, with the lithium probably lasting longer than the silicon. The lithium ion are rated at 400-600 deep charge cycles and the silicon are rated at 400.

As to battery weight, lead-acid is the heaviest. It looks like the silicon batteries come in around 50 pounds and the lithium ion come in at 25 pounds. Thus, the lithium ion are the better technology for a scooter, but the silicon isn't bad.

The problems with build quality aren't focused on the XB-700Li, but on X-treme scooters in general. My understanding is that X-treme scooters are produced by a variety of manufacturers, with Mountain Chen being one of those makers. If both the AER and the XB-700Li are produced by Chen, then I would expect the build quality to be comperable. However, I am trying to determine for fact if Chen makes both or either.

Thanks for your thoughts....anyone else?

boyelectric
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

The XB-700li is classified as an electric-assist bicycle in most places. I cannot see the specs for the Aer E-800, but from the photo, I don't see pedals (a requirement from some municipalities, like mine).

I cannot speak authoritatively about the silicon batteries, but when I was researching battery chemistries, the silicon ones were not stacking up very favorably. The lithium batteries used in the XB-700li are LiMnO2; I would have preferred LiFePO4, but that's a LOT more money.

That being said, I personally like the styling of the Aer E-800, over the XB-700li; I bought the latter.

deadmanwins
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

You're right, I don't see pedals either http://aerscooters.com/. I'll post tomorrow when I see the scooter in person.

The most specific information that I found about how silicon batteries compare I found here: http://www.urbanmover.com/technology_batteries_silicone.htm

I agree that lithium ion are superior.

I'm surprised that you like the Aer styling better. I think the XB-700li looks really cool. Now that I see that you have a 700Li, how do you like it?

ttunes
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

I'm certainly no expert. I've been lurking and looking at e-bikes for a few weeks now. I still haven't bought but that day is coming.
When looking at the specs for the AER-800 it is advertising an 800 watt motor. I think the legal max to be considered an e-bike is 750watts. This might be the reason you are not seeing pedals. It may be falling into the e-moped classification.

Just a thought.
Thom

deadmanwins
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Hi Thom--

I think you're right that the AER-800 is probably classified as an e-moped. Fortunately for me, since I live in Colorado, that doesn't make any difference. I include the following information as I know that there are people on this forum who are from Colorado.

Per the city where I live http://www.ci.loveland.co.us/police/traffic/gopeds.htm I am able to make a few observations:

1) Pedals are not an issue in Colorado;
2) Mopeds and electric bikes are treated the same;
3) Each require registration and the placing of a plate, with a cost of $5 for 3 years (I can live with that);
4) Each require insurance (which I would do anyway);
5) A moped or electric bike can ride in bike lanes (which we have an abundance of) or at the right edge of the road;
6) A moped or electric bike cannot be designed to exceed 30 mph, which is either at or above the limit designed for both the XB-700Li and the AER E-800;
7) A moped or electric bike cannot exceed 6 brake-horsepower, which is as I understand it, is 8952 watts. Thus, both bike are well under that limit.

Thanks for your insight as to why the AER doesn't have pedals.

Jerry

boyelectric
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Nice! So far I really like the XB-700li. I need to get a couple parts replaced, but other than that it seems strong. I like it better than the unmodified XB-600 I had before. If I still had the XB-600, it would be modified by now, but I doubt I could have justified upgrading the old batteries to the lithium that I wanted, and got with the XB-700li.

In Washington State, we have a variation:

RCW 46.04.169
Electric-assisted bicycle.

"Electric-assisted bicycle" means a bicycle with two or three wheels, a saddle, fully operative pedals for human propulsion, and an electric motor. The electric-assisted bicycle's electric motor must have a power output of no more than one thousand watts, be incapable of propelling the device at a speed of more than twenty miles per hour on level ground, and be incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human power alone is used to propel the device beyond twenty miles per hour.

deadmanwins
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Well my wife and I went to Small Planet E Vehicles in Longmont, CO yesterday to buy an AER E-800.

Tom was great to deal with, very patient and insightful. We told him what we were wanting. He recommended the Zapino. He said he did not have any AERs in stock and might not order anymore as they really would only go 22-24 mph.

I found that the AER is built on the same chasis as the Zapino as well as a bike he carried by Lance. For all purposes, they look identical.

So, after much further discussion (drum roll, please)...we bought a Zapino. :)

I wouldn't have paid full price ($3495)for one. But, he said he had gotten a good price and would sell me one for $3000. I then asked if he would honor his 10% off offer for V members in good standing. http://visforvoltage.org/forum/3388-special-deal-quotvquot-members

He said he would honor the 10% off. The bike has 48 miles on it and we found a couple of small places where the paint was rubbed off. Tom said he would take another $100 off. So that brought us to a final price of $2600--which I feel is very good.

As I said Tom was great to deal with. He has 2 service guys besides himself, so I believe he'll be there to help when I have problems.

Now I only need do is to build up the courage to ride the darn thing. ;)

reikiman
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Congradulations!!

deadmanwins
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Re: X-Treme XB-700Li or AER E-800

Thank You.

Our community is wonderful for wide streets and lots of bike lanes. Without those options, I probably wouldn't have made this decision to go a little greener. :P

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