Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

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zapmat2
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Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

Hi,
I posted previously regarding electric scooters as Zapmat. I'm now interested in electric kits for bikes as my needs have changed. Any recommendations? I would prefer a front hub motor that can be pedal assisted with a rear mounted battery. I commute about 12 miles and have charging available at both ends. I'm looking for reliability and I do hit some hills as I'm in Colorado. Also, a reliable source for one would be appreciated as well.
Thanks.

davew
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

As it happens I live in Colorado: What part of the state are you in?

As it happens I am a moderator: The zapmat account is still active. Is there a problem with the old account?

"we must be the change we wish to see in the world"

spinningmagnets
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

I recommend you thoroughly investigate ampedbikes.com, and the 9-continents kit from ebikes.ca

dogman
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

58_TOOTH_CRANK_small_pic.jpg This what you have in mind? What is your budget? If it is small, ampedbikes 9 continents is a good choice. Also Wilderness Energy type kits from hightekbikes.com . For that length commute you may have trouble making the distance with a sla battery pack, so getting the WE or other kits from Ebay complete with batteries won't do you much good. Run these kits with a pingbattery.com 36 or 48v 20 ah lifepo4 battery. It's gonna cost you a bit more than $1000.

How steep and long of hills? If they are really steep and long, like more than 10% for more than a mile, then you need a lot more money to up the ante or you need to lower the speed expectations. The cheaper way is a gearmotor, and running it at lower voltage, like 36v, and speeds around 15 mph, you might make it on Sla batteries, or a smaller lifepo4, or nimh pack. Some of the lower power gearmotors like the bafang, are pretty miserly on the amp hours. Expect to pay around $800. The speed will be slow compared to direct drive, but it will grind up the hills with little problem. Overvolting these motors may strip the gears, so 36v is all you should be using. Some can go 48v.

The high speed high power route, is like all boy toys, no upper limit on cost. Start with a chrystalite 5300 series motor, sometimes sold by name, like phoenix, or brute. This is the fastest most powerfull direct drive hubmotors for bikes currently avaliable. Ebikes-ca is the best vendor. Sla batteries can run this motor, but range will not be 12 miles uphill. Really expensive lifepo4, like A123, headway, and PSI cells work best with this high current draw motors. Less expensive lifepo4, like ping, needs a big pack, like two 16 ah 48v packs in paralell connection for 48v. These motors really shine at 72v, but then you are into the high dollar cells, where you have to build your own battery. There are too many battery options to discuss in one post, but the x5 motors can do motorcycle like speeds and torque.

Having said all that, you most likely would be satisfied by getting an inexpensive kit, a pingbattery, and riding that. I do a 15 mile commute home with a mile of 10% grade, and including the ups and downs, 1000 feet of vertical climb on the way. I ride the WE brushless hub, and a 36v pingbattery. It goes about 23-24 mph, and on the uphill climb home, I get the 15 miles in one hour, only slowing down for the big hill, and mostly riding around 20 mph on moderate uphills. It's a good setup for the long haul, but 48v would be nicer, having a bit more speed on the uphills. If you are going to ride to a ski area, get a gearmotor, but for riding around town, up and down shorter hills, the cheaper motors will work quite well, and make the battery go farther. I get about 20 miles of reliable full throttle range out of mine, but can stretch it much further by slowing down.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

chas_stevenson
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

dogman,

I like your ride and was wondering what size chain ring you have on the crank. I also like the battery case, good choice.

Grandpa Chas S.

zapmat2
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

The account is fine, I set up the other from work as I didn't have access to my home email to get my password or any responses. I live and work in Boulder County (Niwot and Louisville). Have you had any experience with the electric bike kits?
Thanks!

zapmat2
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

Thanks dogman,
Cool dog. I like your ride as well. My ride isn't quite that technical, I've pedaled it many times, but with the extra push I'd do it more often. Basically a 3 or 4% grade over a couple of miles at each end, one up one down, wish I could regenerate. A couple of short 5-6 % climbs, but only maybe a 1/4 mile. The WE brushless sounds good to me. I think I can live with the SLA battery for now, $ are tight these days. If I find I need more I can move up to something better later on. I have an electric scooter, but the bike would work better for my needs right now.
Thanks for all your help.
Zapmat

dogman
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

I got lucky and found a 58 tooth chainring on ebay. I took a chance on it, and it not only fit one of the cranks I had in my parts pile, but even went on the bike without rubbing the frame. I can pedal with force up to 32 mph. It's perfect for the ride to work, that is mostly downhill.

I understand that money is tight, but I never got more than about 8 miles out of sla's on a brushed hub. You might get 12 miles out of the brushless by going to 48v with a fourth battery, and then riding slower. One trick you will need to know, the hub will cause drag when not energized, so as soon as you see the battery light start to flicker, reduce the throttle to nearly zero, and allow just enough juice to flow to pedal without the cogging drag. It's better to slow down sooner and have a heavy bike, than have to deal with the cogging drag once the battery goes low. If you can't afford enough battery to get there, you may be better off with a gearmotor. then you can pedal some, and throttle some, alternating without the cogging to hold you back.
Some of the smaller geared hubmotors are low wattage, 15 mph things that get double the range out of the batteries than a 500 watt direct drive hub. They climb hills well because of the gears.

But maybe your best bet is to get a WE or something like it, with batteries, and then find money for better batteries later. Maybe you can stretch your range by putting the bike on a bus for part of the ride. I still do that sometimes, allowing me to go far, and still come home without a recharge.

Looks like the best deal out there in a WE kit is ebay, my-e-bike is selling them for 375 including shipping. That kit comes with a set of 3 sla's.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

davew
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

The account is fine, I set up the other from work as I didn't have access to my home email to get my password or any responses. I live and work in Boulder County (Niwot and Louisville). Have you had any experience with the electric bike kits?

I do have some. More importantly I just pulled a Wilderness Energy BD36 off of one of my bikes and you are welcome to it. I am certain the motor and throttle are good. The controller I can be certain of and the battery is end-of-life. I'm up in Longmont.

"we must be the change we wish to see in the world"

WonderProfessor
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

I recommend you thoroughly investigate ampedbikes.com, and the 9-continents kit from ebikes.ca

On the ebikes.ca web site, the owners really talk up the eZee motor over the Crystalyte and even the Nine Continents motors. Has anyone had any experience with the eZee motors?

Still looking for the perfect combination to electrify my Gold Rush Replica to help me with a 20-mile one-way commute to work ...

dogman
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Re: Looking for a hub motor kit for a mountain bike

A free motor? go for it. But I don't think you will get 20 miles out of a bl36 motor. I rode one last year for 2000 miles, and the most range I ever made on 3 sla batteries was 15 miles, 90% downhill. Typical range riding slow, about 15 mph was 8 miles on NEW 12ah sla's. The brushed motors really are worse for range by about 30%. But go for it, get your feet wet, learn about how to ride as efficient as you can, and upgrade when you get money. You might make it work by using a combination of less expensive batteries, like a sla pack plus a nicad pack from ebikes ca. Or two nicad packs, or something less costly than a $650 48v-20 ah pingbattery. One 36v 8ah nicad would take you a minimum of 8 miles at full throttle, and slowly, allmost make the 12 miles. Get one now, and another as soon as you can afford it? Nicad can potentially go 1000 cycles just like lithium. If you do have the money after a deal on the motor, just get a 20 ah ping and ride for years on it.

The nine continents motor is supposed to be real nice, and the clyte 406 or 407 is comparable to the 2009 Aotema (WE) motors. Ampedbikes is 9 cont too. But basicly there is no magic motor that is miles longer range at the same speed and power. Physics is physics.

But gearmotors can be the long range answer since they freewheel. This allows the best use of hypermiling technique. The pulse and glide, with freeweeling and pedaling can greatly extend range on a battery. I found the pulse and glide on a bd motor did little to extend range since the cogging of the motor slows you down. Cogging force is light at low speed, but at 20 mph it's signifigant. Gearmotors are also able to climb, though slower, with less power. It doesn't take a genius to see a gearmotor like the ezee, bafang, or whatever, running on a 36v 10 amp (360 watts) controller will sip watts, while a bigger 600 watt motor will take twice as much, and likely be twice as fast. Regen is overrated, and not that usefull to ebikes, unless they cross a huge hill everyday. Only a small percentage of power is recovered, maybe enough for a half mile of riding.

Be the pack leader.
36 volt sla schwinn beach cruiser
36 volt lifepo4 mongoose mtb
24 volt sla + nicad EV Global

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