Vectrix battery cooling (again) and how to run the fans as needed

I might actually start building and selling ABCool units.

They will of course only work if you have a power point to plug them in.

(There would also be a possibility to use a switch mode power supply to suck energy out of the battery at will, but that is fraught with various dangers, like zapping yourself during installation, or draining the battery too low.)

The ABCool will be made so that it is a "Plug-and-Play" device, requiring no modifications to the scooter at all. I'm just waiting for the supplier to send me the AC cables for the 12V power supplies (they forgot them).

I'll put the first one on ebay when it's ready.

The design will be "open", with the expressed recommendation to build your own instead of paying me lots of money!

And each one will be used, meaning no warranty, but tested for a week or so in the Vectux to make sure it is working well!

Is there any 'secret' combination of sequence with the key switch, brake levers, etc that make the fans run?

Thanks a lot!
Claudio

Yes there is. I saw the engineer, who checked my battery fans, when one wasn't working, do it, while the bike was switched on and not plugged in. Unfortunately I wasn't paying attention and I don't know what it is.

Maybe one of the Vectrix staff on this forum can tell us what it is ;-)

There is no option to start the fans working ( manually ) if the bike is not plugged in. I agree with AndY1 that there is possibility to switch on the battery fans by the diagnostic programme but this is only for service purposes and takes 20 seconds - then it stops. This is what the engineer did actually on your bike ( I remember this issue )
Anyway, this is kind of clue for us which is appreciated and might be concidered to implement.
Best
Pawel Koch

Hi,
I am also cooling a lot, at least 2 hours at the office in the underground garage which is never warmer then 25°c even in this hot summer either in the middle of the night, and for now I did not have a shadow of a problem with the vec range .
also I was delivered with the new soft already in the bike.. so it my be the reason why I could ride 11000 km on this pack ... I pray everyday that the story will go on
however I have noticed that the vec is choossing to start his fans or not , even if a long delay time is prgrammes mine sometimes does not start , and starts later ... it certainly happends when the air temp is too warm to have any cooling effect , also I noticed that in the winter is start cooling then stops and sometimes starts again .
I think that the vec over a long delay period makes decisions according on it's internnal pack conditions and according to the external air conditions, it seems that it's start until temps get below 25° and the stop, and when temps get's back higher then 25°it starts again cause most of the time the first cooling is not enough to get rid of the heat even if temerature had first gone below 25° .
it is a bit ood but well it works.
as for abc cooling I'll buy it when it will be available .

...
1- Does ABC will work both for 110 - 220 v?

Yes, just use a 110-240V switchmode power supply.

2- You said the ABC is "plug and 'pray'". How is that possible? From the pictures, I see there is need to open the bike, making holes, etc. Can you please elaborate?

There is no need to cut any cables or remove connectors. Just two bolts need to be undone to lift the seat off, then plug the ABCool into the cooling impeller connector and the original connector into the ABCool. I bought a load of the correct connectors to make it possible. I'm not sure which pictures you refer to; there is no need to make holes. It is fully reversible within one minute, the only tool needed is a 10mm spanner and something to cut the cable ties which you will add to keep it all tidy. Thinking of it, I'll look for a reversible (re-usable) cable tie solution so that the ABCool can be removed on the roadside with just the 10mm spanner if needed.

3- Is the point before is correct, why the installation of the ABC will avoid the warranty?

That is a question I cannot answer. It's between you and your warranty provider. But I cannot think of a way to prove that an ABCool has ever been connected.
There is one way that I can think of how the ABCool could actually cause a fault that could reasonably be blamed on it's addition: That is premature failure of the cooling impellers, due to vastly increased running times. If an impeller eventually fails, then the built-in safety mechanisms and warning signs would still function (just as they did in AndY1's Vectrix when it was first delivered with one malfunctioning impeller).

4- What about my specific question about how to run the fans when 'manually'? Is that what the ABC does?
Thanks!
Claudio

The ABCool simply puts 12V through both cooling impeller motors and shuts off the path for the 12V supply from the original Vectrix electronics to the impellers. As far as I know, the stock electronics are utterly unaware of the presence of the ABCool and the "already running" state of the cooling impellers (Just as the stock electronics are unaware of the "not running" state when an impeller is malfunctioning.) The stock electronics only notice the time-delayed effects of the running ABCool: Cooler battery cells and flatter temperature gradient through the battery after prolonged running. (The fans should actually run and just recirculate air instead of sucking fresh air in once the average battery temperature is low enough. That happens a little bit through a small recirculating portion of the airstream already built into the cooling plenum design. But that's another project...)
When the ABCool in not plugged into the grid, then the stock systems run the impellers unchanged.

The ABCool described on this page: http://visforvoltage.org/book/ev-collaborative-hand-books/7054 is not exactly what I will be selling; particularly there will be no timers, data logger, surge protectors, animal exclusion mesh etc included. But I'll make that clearer later on when I've built the first one for sale.

Thank you for your proposal Mik
Let us know when your product is ready.

Hi,
Thank you for your fast and detailed response (I hope the built up of the ABC will be the same way!).
Since my profession is quality assurance and quality control, I'd like to suggest you test each unit a couple of times before you sell them.
Electronics may give surprises!
Thanks!
Claudio

That's why I want to sell them "used"! In other words, thoroughly tested!

I have bought 3 of the same power supplies which I used for the 2nd gen ABCool, just waiting for the cables.
I also bought three relays identical to the one I have used.
But each unit will ride to work with me for at least a few days and be exposed to the vibrations of on-road use etc.

Clargos, i have exactly the same needs of being able to turn on the fans just after i drive. Obviously i program it for 2 hours delay and then and shut the bike with while im pressing the left brake. I have to then program my phone to advise me 5 minuites before the 2 hour get over and then i unplug.
Mr Pawel, if just there would be a way to do the following things:
1. Be able to program fans to function (while the bike is plugged) but only to cool, when the time ends the bike shouldnt start rechraging
2. Be able to choose between what data is displayed , between having the estimated range or havingthe temperature readout instead(in the place of the estimated range, leaving the trip data as it is)
3. If possible, making the trip A reading reset itself automatically after every reboot, and being able to choose between if it resets or no with a blinking of itself.If the s button is not pressed then by default it resets.

I dont think it should be too complicated in implementing these in the next software update.
By the way, will we have a new software update?
Thankyou very much for your time.
RaDy

I agree. Having battery temperature and Voltage shown while riding would be an excellent feature.

after I pull the left brake lever and switch off the bike, the dashboard goes off BUT the 'speedometer' stays somewhere just above 30 'km/h'

Dear clargros.
When you pull the left brake lever and switch off the bike, the spedometer's nail shows the twist grip's sensor reading. Try to move forward and backward the twist grip, and you'll see how it moves up and down. Take into account that if you pull the right lever also, you'll get the correct calibration level, slightly above the 40 km/h mark. If the nail is just around 30km/h, the twist sensor is not well calibrated and you can experience malfunctioning while ridding the bike. Pleae consider recalibrating the sensor as soon as possible.

I think I have all the parts together to start building three ABCool units.

Two days were spent just fiddling and getting the Vectux impeller connector back to original configuration, so that I can just "plug and play test" new ABCool units.
Interestingly, it turned out that the three cables going to the connector are shielded, like coaxial television antenna cable. I wonder why???

The ABCool I am making now will have the right connectors so that this sort of fiddly work can be avoided!

Fixed again and almost like new:

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In the last few days I also built an ABCool unit following a different approach, using diodes instead of a relay. The idea came from another forum member here, I'm not sure if s/he wants me to mention who it is.

Anyhow, I ended up riding to work without an ABCool for the first time in about a year today, because it was all in pieces, and as chance had it, I promptly needed to give the Vectux a full charge (instead of partial as I usually do) because something came up which meant I might have needed more range on the way back home. The battery ended up 36degC warm and I could not cool it down all day. Bummer. When I got back home the impellers even came on spontaneously after turning the Vectux off. A reminder of what it was like before I started using the ABCool all the time!

Here are some pictures of the new design prototype:

I do not like it very much, particularly because the diodes get quite hot, around 55degC, and that's in 22degC ambient temperature. I think the relay uses less energy, or at least it spreads the heat over a larger area, so that there is no chance of anything getting too hot when it comes in contact with the part. It also means that hot glue can be used for the relay design, but maybe hot glue will melt again when used for the diode ABCool.

The most important reason is though, that the relay can be used to power the impellers with a current source other than the stock electronics even if the voltage is a bit lower than the 12V of the stock electronics. The relay needs about 7.8V to operate, and the impellers need 7V minimum each when used alone, but more when used together because they are not exactly identical. So with the original relay design I can power the impellers with a 6s NiMH battery out of the boot. The fans run slower and much quieter that way. Of course, a 12V battery could be used as well and it would run the impellers at full speed. But there are situations (like air conditioned living rooms in hot climates) when it is sooo nice when the impellers run a bit quieter!

With the diodes design, it would always be the higher voltage source that drives the impellers.

Here is a schematic of what I put together yesterday:

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So, having explored an alternative route, it's back to the original plan, a 4 pole double throw relay, with the addition of a connector that will allow plugging in of a 7.5V to 12V DC power source instead of the switch-mode 12V power supply. The the impellers can also be run at will whilst riding.