ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

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pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

True, but as for using the number of Watt-hours as a "fuel gauge" I find using Ah consumed more accurate, that's the only reason I list Ah.

It looks like the DC/DC converter has been delivered and waiting for me at the post office :)

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Good news and bad news.

GOOD: The DC/DC converter arrived

BAD: The 720p sunglasses arrived but it non stop crashes and turns off. So unfortunately I can't make any more videos as I was planning to.

I will look at installing the HID lights this weekend. So hopefully the DC converter works better than what the sunglasses did.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

MEroller
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Hey, MEroller, you said your "projector lights" are bright enough to ride safely at night. Are you using HID projector or are you talking about the normal halogen lights in the reflectors? Maybe they made the reflectors better in the "Thunder" model.

Here is a small close-up of Thunder's Halogen Projectors: On the left of the pic is low beam, on the right high beam:
Thunder-Halogen_Projectors.jpg

And now comes your interesting quest for finding a spot large enough for your big new DC/DC-converter :-)

My rides:
2017 Zero S ZF6.5 11kW, erider Thunder 5kW

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Holy cow that looks nice MERoller.

My HID installation will have to wait for a while now because my bike lost power just as I got home. Long story short, a loose positive lead blew the hall sensors in the motor and wiped the programming in the PDT box. I'm now using the second hall sensor cable and my wife's PDT box.

I've now checked all the bolts (except battery pack).

While the bike was opened, it looks like the DC converter will fit nicely above the charger. I might be able to install the lights over the weekend.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

IBScootn
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

My HID installation will have to wait for a while now because my bike lost power just as I got home. Long story short, a loose positive lead blew the hall sensors in the motor and wiped the programming in the PDT box.

Holly cow I thought this was a production bike. Or did I not read carefully enough to understand it was a funky, experimental-trial build like the CuMoCo bikes? Let's go back and highlight some of the problems you've mentioned:

Faulty blinkers
Faulty headlight switch
No BMS
Sluggish acceleration from standstill on slope
Poor overall acceleration
Regen unexpectedly cuts out
Speedo off 20-36%
cowling cracked from hitting connection box
Plastic swing arm removing insulation off 3 phase wiring
Wife's throttle not set right
Severe vibration at top speed
Decals showing 5000w on a 8000w bike
Lightning bolt sticker falling off
Rear wheel locking up too easily (questionable ABS brake)
Loose axel nuts
Loose positive lead blowing motor sensors and zapping PDT settings

Yikes - either this is a trial run bike or three monkeys assembled it.

I hope you are riding your dealer to improve quality control!

I hope you have found all the issues on this bike and your luck will be golden from here on,

Motorcycles: 2011 ZEV Trail 7100, 84V, 60AH, 60+mph, Cycle Analyst, TNC throttle, modified charger. 2013 Kymco GT300i
Bicycles: 2017 Sondors Thin
Cars: 2016 Leaf SV, 30KWH pack. 2007 CR-V
Solar array: 5KW. Cost per lifetime KWH produced $0.073
Bi

MEroller
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Holy cow that looks nice MERoller.

Nice it looks, but these pretty decent lights are ALL - as in every single bike - set too low down to make any sense. It can be adjusted to make pretty good sense, mind you, but I am beginning to supect that the rear suspension on the electrified version of this bike raises it's rump too high up, which could account for several of the woes of this design.

Your newest breakdown DOES sound pretty worrying... :-(

My rides:
2017 Zero S ZF6.5 11kW, erider Thunder 5kW

PzlPete
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I was thinking the same thing. That is a heck of a lot of problems in such a short period of time.

I have 5745 miles on my Xtreme 4000li and it has been litterally trouble free. Despite the fact that our bikes are based on the same chasis, I have yet to see a single one of the problems that you mention.

CHL lithium battery
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

5745 miles without BMS ? amazing ....

21cell of 60AH on XM4000li ? what's the range now ?

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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Well 5745 miles = 9245Km is that much for a one bike that is used by the same person (probably is taking good care of it)!
Small summery for PDT Technology scooters in Israel:
• 6 shops of Pizza Hut full electric, doing around 80 km a day with several drivers using each bike (all of them 16 years children’s that drive without mercy)
• 2 shops of Burger delivery that are doing 2700km a month that is between 100 to 130km a day.
• Our pilot scooters over 20000km each.
All scooters are used by fleets so this will give you to what direction PDT is aiming her products
All the best
IMG-20111120-00528.jpg

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Yeah, I must say that this last problem I've had is the only one that has stopped the bike working. Lol. I got in trouble from my wife for not doing the 1500km service properly. But even though I had a problem, all it took was an email and I had a reply from PDT within an hour saying what was wrong and then eRider Melbourne sending a replacement on Friday afternoon which should get here Monday. They really do stand behind their product.

I'm not unhappy with the bike at all. I still love it.

I have just finished installing the HID lights on the scooter. They work perfect. But after seeing how much power they draw, I don't think the stock DC/DC converter could handle it. I have 2x35w HID's, that's 70w right.....NOPE. When you first turn them on, together they draw around 180watts for about 20 seconds and then it settles to about 75watts.

I went for a test drive while it was just starting to rain and the lights look great, but they are pointing WAY too low. I will have to try and adjust them when it's dark.

I mounted the new DC/DC converter on top of the charger which is just under the seat and infront of the underseat storage bucket. Unfortunately it is about 1cm too big and I can't get the plastic cover back on.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

PzlPete
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Yes 5745 miles without BMS. 20 cell, 40AH. My batteries are circa 2008, so they are now three years old, and the cycle was showroom display when I purchased it, so I am not sure what kind of care they received the first 2 years. I have taken great care of them over the year I have owned it so far. My range is about 33 miles at this point.

I have a full two year warranty on my batteries, which is outstanding. So I will be taking her apart in a couple of months and measuring each cell again. At 3800 miles my lowest cell was 3.52 volts and my strongest cell was about 4.07. I really want to get my 47 mile range back and I will. The 4000li has been an outstanding trouble free cycle.

IFIMotors
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

So your scooter is 5745 mils are over 3 years of use ……

With our new fast half hour charge system we will have this distance in 50 days, so understand what hard work and durability we are demanding from our system.

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

HID UPDATE:
Installed Sunday 27 November 2011
2490km on the ODO
Let's see if they last...

Here is the 400W DC/DC converter, even with 180w load it sits on a ROCK SOLID 13.81v. I mounted it on top of the 10A charger. The DC converter is the black box, the charger is the copper coloured box and to the left is the stock silver DC converter.
IMG_4324.JPG

Here is a photo of the 2 HID's turned on. But I am concerned about the bottom part of the original reflector housing, it REFLECTS the HID light above the lo-beam cut-off and causes a fair bit of glare. I may have to paint this black or something.
IMG_4334.JPG

Here is a photo of the 1x35w halogen bulb and a 55w H4 halogen bulb
IMG_4488.jpg

Here is a photo of the 2x35w HID projectors.
IMG_4365.jpg

2x35w HALOGEN
IMG_4336.jpg

2x35w HID - Notice the nice sharp lo beam cut-off. BUT also notice the "glare" above the cut-off line, this is from the relected part as described above. This may be a problem. As you can see, I need to raise the HID's just a bit, they are pointing down a bit too much.
IMG_4335.jpg

As you can see the HID bulbs are a HUGE improvement but as from the last photo, you can see I need to raise them just a bit.

I went for a ride out of town in the 90km/h zone in the pitch black where I was also too scared to ride faster than 60kmh because of the poor lighting provided by the HALOGEN lights, I am happy to report that with the HID's I was happy to go 90kmh because the lighting is fantastic now. Best of all I didn't have 1 car flash me because of my lights. After the 53km ride I got home and felt the 400w DC/DC converter and it was barely even warm so it is not struggling at all.

So if anyone is thinking of installing HID's into these scooters then you can rest assured, there are HID projector kits out there that will physically fit.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Hi,

I thought I'd just add that I am at 2490km and I have had little problem with the scooter. From my point of view, the scooter has been flawless, little things don't worry me, like a faulty blinker that only required a screw to be tightened. The thing that I am most impressed with is the after sales support from Erider Australia and also PDT. What I like the most is that these two companies really know their product and REALLY stand behind it. I really do think PDT have put together a good system by limiting the current, it allows me to get the range I want without stressing any parts.

The BIG things like charger, batteries are more important to me. I am VERY impressed with these CHL cells, even under 115A load on a freezing cold day they barely even dropped below 74v.

And now I have a nice bright set of headlights, I look forward to many more KM's of worry free driving.

I was at a friends place today, he has just got a 250cc motorbike second hand for $5000. He has just spent around $1000 fixing it up with timing chains, muffler, the thing that makes the spark plug go ZAP etc etc, and yet he STILL mocked me for having an electric scooter. He just could not understand how a vehicle with 80 km range could be useful. He tried the "it just takes me 5 minutes to fill up", and I reply "mine recharges INSTANTLY because I turn it on when I get home, and when I wake up, it's full." I just love annoying petrol heads like that.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

Aircon
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

He tried the "it just takes me 5 minutes to fill up",

I REALLY don't miss petrol stations at all! One of the highlights of EV ownership.

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I REALLY don't miss petrol stations at all! One of the highlights of EV ownership.

Me either!! I thought I would have a big smile everytime I drove past a petrol station but the truth is, I don't even notice petrol stations anymore, unless the cars are lined up blocking the driveway trying to get in.

I find just plugging in at night so much more convenient, I do the same thing with my iphone when I go to bed. When I wake up, the phone is charged and so is the scooter, so charge time isn't as bad as I thought it would be. 5 hours for a FULL 50Ah charge (85-90km) sounds bad, but If I get home at 6pm and plug in, go inside and start cooking dinner and then watch some tv, by the time I go to bed at 11pm it's already charged. Whereas if I had a petrol scooter and leave a little late one morning for work, I have to find a petrol station, only to find it FULL and several pumps closed (they close pumps in australia when petrol is cheap and open them when it's expensive to make more money), 8 minute wait, 4 minutes to fill up, 4 minutes to pay, so that's 16 minutes to fill up. On the electric scooter it's only a 12 minute ride from home to work, or 8 minutes if I take the fast way. Then my petrol friends say "you have to charge it every night, I can go 400km or 2 weeks on a 5 minute fill up". Even though they only ride the same distance from home to work as me, they still think they need a vehicle that can go 400km per fill.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

gasdive
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I'm finding the same thing. I've got a Zero DS and the range is about 50 km. No-one can see how that can be useful even when I tell them that it's got 50 km range every time I get on the bike. They're all convinced that it only takes one minute to fill a petrol bike... I don't know how they can think that, but it's universal, like there's some sort of blind spot around it. I say "would you think a mobile phone was more useful if you had to take it to a shop to recharge it but it only took one minute instead of a couple of hours plugged in at home?". Apparently "that's different". Never any kind of good reason why "that's different", it just is...

=:)

Jason
Blogging my Zero DS from day one http://zerods.blogspot.com/

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I've got a Zero DS

DROOL!!

I say "would you think a mobile phone was more useful if you had to take it to a shop to recharge it but it only took one minute instead of a couple of hours plugged in at home?". Apparently "that's different"

LOL!! I'll have to remember that one.

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

CHL lithium battery
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)
He tried the "it just takes me 5 minutes to fill up",

I REALLY don't miss petrol stations at all! One of the highlights of EV ownership.

If there is a 100A current charging statation,your scooter could be half an hour 80% fully charged too, CHL battery can bear big current charged.

PzlPete
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I have a car in my garage, and my 4000li.

Every morning when I go the garage, one is full, and one is not.

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

If there is a 100A current charging statation,your scooter could be half an hour 80% fully charged too, CHL battery can bear big current charged.

Ha! I wish there were some 100A charging stations around!! The Australian government are totally stupid and have now bought in a "CARBON TAX". I bet you none of the money from this new tax will be used to help EV's take off. Our government think they are "world leaders" in EV with 3 charge stations in Melbourne, 2 in Sydney and 1 in Canberra......hmm, by the sounds of IFIMotors I think Israel is setting the pace with ev businesses like Pizza Hut and Burger Delivery.

I have been taking note of power points around canberra, like on the side of street lights, petrol stations :-) and car parks. They are just normal 240v 10A plugs, and because my charger is 87.6v 10A charger I can only charge at 10A regardless. I tend to get about 14km per 1 hour of charging.

Hi CHL, if you would like to send me a free charger, I am happy to test it out for you :-) But honestly, I am LOVING your lithium batteries. Keep up the good work :-)

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

CHL lithium battery
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Thanks for yr appreciation,we don't have 100A charger either,but 40A chargers have been widely used in PDT scooter and maybe next shipment to Australia.

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Thanks for yr appreciation,we don't have 100A charger either,but 40A chargers have been widely used in PDT scooter and maybe next shipment to Australia.

40A chargers!! That's 87.6v x 40A = 3.5kW!! WOW!!

These must be wall mounted or something. That would pretty much recharge my bike from a BIG ride (42Ah) in about an hour! I'll be happy to try one for you :)

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

antiscab
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Thanks for yr appreciation,we don't have 100A charger either,but 40A chargers have been widely used in PDT scooter and maybe next shipment to Australia.

TC Charger (Hangzhou Tiecheng) make a 4kw charger that will do 40A,
You can run it from some 10A powerpoints, as they generally have 15A Circuit Breakers

100A would need 3-phase,
but then there is always this project:
http://www.emotorwerks.com/cgi-bin/VMcharger.pl

You can make a charger as powerful as you want relatively cheaply

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

Aircon
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)
3 charge stations in Melbourne

Where are they?

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)
3 charge stations in Melbourne

Where are they?

https://www.chargepoint.net.au/index.php/authz/login.html

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

gasdive
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

The Australian government are totally stupid

The NSW government mandated that EV charging should be put in at all new and refurbished train stations. In fact, 3% of all parking spots are supposed to be set aside for electric vehicle charging. I had quite a bit of too and fro with the TCA who do the refurbishments for the railways. Basically at the end of the day they're not doing it because they don't know what standards may be introduced at some unspecified point in the future. Makes one wonder how they manage to do anything if they are holding off in case some standard might be introduced by someone somewhere sometime later. How can they build stairs without knowing what standards might be introduced at some unspecified later point for the constructions of public staircases? So of the 165 charge points they were supposed to put in, they've installed a total of... None.

Well done...

I did point out that there's a perfectly good standard for 240 volt 15 amp sockets that every EV sold or intended for sale in Australia can already use, that would fully recharge almost any EV in the 10 hours that most cars sit in a railway parking spot, but that apparently isn't good enough. Best hold off in case someone comes up with some other standard.

=:)

Jason
Blogging my Zero DS from day one http://zerods.blogspot.com/

pcarlson1979
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

I did point out that there's a perfectly good standard for 240 volt 15 amp sockets that every EV sold or intended for sale in Australia can already use

I'd even be happy to see 15A sockets installed because my 10A plug will fit in a 15A socket. If I go shopping for 2 hours then that's another 30km back into my battery, IF my charger could handle 15A then I could charge at 87.6v @ 40A!!! So every hour I would get 60km back into the battery!!! *drooool*

------------------------------
eRider 8000w Scooter - PDT Version
72v 50AH CHL battery
350A Sevcon controller

24km: Delivered - 24 September 2011
2490km: Installed dual 35w HID lights Bi-Xenon Projectors - 27 November 2011
8313km: Installed BMS -

CHL lithium battery
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Is there any E-car charging station in Australia which also open for your scooter ?

antiscab
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Re: ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Is there any E-car charging station in Australia which also open for your scooter ?

Theres a few in Melbourne (Victoria, Australia), also a few in Perth (Western Australia).

Adelaide (South Australia) has a few as far as I know.
The City Mayor even has his own electric car (paid for with his own money no less)

I know of heaps of normal 10A power points around Perth that I would occasionally use when my Vectrix still had the old nimh batteries.
Though those powerpoints were never intended for vehicle use, they just happened to be on the outside of the building

I haven't used any of them since going Lithium though....

Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

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