Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

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antiscab
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Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Hi Guys,

Just finished my leaf module conversion with the zeva EVMS BMS

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antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

oops, the last picture doesn't really belong :p

anyway, as many of you have done, you can convert without a BMS, by doing those functions manually

This conversion kit is AUS$900 + shipping (you still need to buy the leaf modules)

It can display every cell voltage, has a fuel guage, and has a touch screen

still does the BMS type things like disconnect the charger when a cell goes too high

includes:
3 x 12 cell modules
1 x master module + current sensor + charger relay + 12v powersupply
1 x touch screen monitor
4 x CAN-Bus cables pre wired
3 x 12 cell wired and numbered plugs
1 x FWX 200A fuse

Edit: I forgot a part when adding costs together - price is AUS$900 + Shipping

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

SunLover
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Wow, serious congrats. Let us know how it all goes.

I love the info you posted at the bottom with the costs - really useful. I assume those are Australian dollars? and I must be misreading the total distance as I read it to be over 79,000 km.

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

I took the bike for a ride today

these leaf modules sure are power dense

I did a full power acceleration - the pack sagged from 144v resting to 139v @ 230A

absolutely amazing :D

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

h0tr0d
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Awesome!

SunLover
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Fantastic!

The cost info is really helpful. Are those Australian dollars?

Kocho
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Yup! Nice to have pretty much full power all the time :)

If you do take some temperature measurements on the Leaf pack in use, can you share? And if you have ventilation or not for the pack? I've been running mine without temp sensors and without ventilation, so I don't know if it heats up during riding and during regen (I know it does not heat-up During charging, as I've hand-felt the pack's temp while the bike was disassembled at home). I doubt it heats-up, because even at highway speeds it barely bets stressed by the current (it's no longer the weakest link in the bike), but would be nice to know for sure.

I'll probably plug in my temp sensors again so I can observe the temperature during/after riding, but it will be a few months before Spring comes 'round here (I don't ride in the Winter).

Thanks!

Sirming
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Awesome!!

Bikemad
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Includes:
1 x FWX 200A fuse

I did a full power acceleration - the pack sagged from 144v resting to 139v @ 230A

If the controller is drawing 230 Amps under full acceleration, why does it only have a 200 Amp fuse?

Experience has shown me that overloading fuses (even slightly) eventually causes this to happen:

Athough if the fuse connection is not very good this can often happen first:

Would it not be worth putting an additional 40 Amp fuse (or possibly a 40 Amp circuit breaker) in parallel with the 200 Amp fuse to prevent it from being overloaded on steep inclines at full power?

I'm also confused as to why there are there so many wires (at least four) connected directly to the battery terminal on the unfused side of the fuse:

Are these all to do with the BMS wiring?

Alan

EDIT: Picture links repaired

oobflyer
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Wow - nice!
I'm still riding my '07 VX-1 with the antiscab conversion kit that I installed in 2011. The LiFePo battery capacity has degraded a bit (still have 80%), but the BMS and everything else still runs perfectly. I wish the Leaf batteries had been available when I did my conversion!

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Hi Sun lover,

prices are indeed in Australian Dollars
The majority of the parts are made in Australia, so even with the falling value of the Aus dollar, the AUS$ price will remain the same

Includes:
1 x FWX 200A fuse

I did a full power acceleration - the pack sagged from 144v resting to 139v @ 230A

If the controller is drawing 230 Amps under full acceleration, why does it only have a 200 Amp fuse?

Hi Alan,

The MC can only draw 230A from the battery between 80kmh and 110kmh

a 200A fuse won't blow immediately if you go past 200A - there's a I^2T value that has to be exceeded first (you can't hold 230A for anywhere near long enough to blow a 200A fuse)
a circuit breaker I^2T value is almost always lower than a fuse (which is why you replace a 10A fuse with a 16A circuit breaker, etc)

the vectrix was originally shipped with a 125A fuse - but these did not leave sufficient margin and did indeed eventually fail (partly because it was possible to draw 120A continuous in some situations)

That is why I supply the same 200A fuse that are now used on the newer vectrix scooters

It is better to have the fuse located on the battery, rather than the motor controller, so that is why it is reloacted.

It is also better to have the fuse mid pack - I am working on copper standoffs to allow that

I'm also confused as to why there are there so many wires (at least four) connected directly to the battery terminal on the unfused side of the fuse:

The smaller wires are for the charger, the external anderson connector (so you can connect another charger or a capacity tester without disassembly) and the BMS
They are protected by a 32A HRC 250vdc/500vac fuse on the positive terminal (not shown)

cheers,
Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

hibba
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Matt give us a call hibba

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Looks like I stand corrected as far as exchange rate goes - my supplier put the prices of the BMS

Cost of the kit is now AUS$1000 + shipping :(

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

LithiumVectrix
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

This build looks so complicated. Look at other overseas builds using Leaf cells and their experience gained on this forum.

Brutus
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Matt - I will get this kit if I can find the cells. My lithim conversion has done 22,000kms but I get a red light from the BMS almost every day - I think from voltage drop when accelerating up hills. So I think the writing is on the wall for my current pack. I also have a frequent encoder error which wasn't fixed by cleaning the sensor as I found described on this forum.
cheers

hybride
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Matt,

When turning off this BMS, does the 1.6mA Cell quiescent current draw stop's too?(from the BMS12 modules) Can you measure?

antiscab
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Matt - I will get this kit if I can find the cells. My lithim conversion has done 22,000kms but I get a red light from the BMS almost every day - I think from voltage drop when accelerating up hills. So I think the writing is on the wall for my current pack.

There are a group in QLD that that import leaf modules on a regular basis
They're called Suzi Auto

Out of curiosity, do you have a cycle analyst? What is the capacity of your lithium battery now?
I wouldn't worry about having to reset the BMS after every ride, as long as you can still charge after riding
22'000km is rather disappointing, but if they still have reasonable Ah capacity I can look at trading them in (I have a solar setup that could use some battery)

When turning off this BMS, does the 1.6mA Cell quiescent current draw stop's too?(from the BMS12 modules) Can you measure?

I think it's 1.6mA drawn on a per cell basis when the BMS12 module is not powered - but I will measure this weekend, particularly if the current draw reduces or goes away when cell voltage gets lower.

We're getting closer to having a setup where if it is forgotten about for a few months, battery death is not the end result

regards,
Matt

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

Brutus
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Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

Hi Matt - I'll check out Suzi Auto - I'll have to phone them - no info on their web page.
When you replied, I was negotiating to buy a far - no electricity, and to get it the power has to bee bought under a river - mega$ - so I was thinking off-grid and a possible use for my cells. But my offers were declined. We have an 8kW system at home but I don't think my system allows for a battery bank - so the cells may be looking for a home. I'd better source some Nissan cells first though.

antiscab
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Points: 1686
Re: Vectrix Leaf BMS kit

When turning off this BMS, does the 1.6mA Cell quiescent current draw stop's too?(from the BMS12 modules) Can you measure?

The 1.6mA draw is present even when turning off

it's an artifact of the LTC chip used for the cell voltage measuring using a linear reg

Daily Ride:
2007 Vectrix, modified with 42 x Thundersky 60Ah
Vectrix 60Ah Lithium Tyres Fuel Registration Insurance cycle analyst 2 x TC Charger & MC
conversion

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