For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

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Kocho
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For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Hello,

I have decided to sell my Vectrix VX-1 and try to get a Zero this year. Make me an offer!

Here are the details. For those who know about the VX-1, sorry for the "sales pitch" in the ad below - comes straight from my Craigslist posting, which may be read by folks who do not know what a VX-1 with Nissan Leaf cells is ;-)

I will also have it on eBay shortly, in case you prefer to deal with me through there. Price is negotiable, within reason (but just see the list of spare parts and that this is virtually new bike with very few miles).

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

For sale is a Vectrix VX-1 electric scooter in excellent condition.

This is a large electric scooter that is highway-legal in most places. To speed is electronically limited to 68 mph (and the bike can get there faster than most vehicles on the road, can maintain it uphill on the interstate, and has no trouble riding it with a full-sized passenger with plenty of space for two-up riding). Motorcycle license is required for this bike, but insurance cost is very low in Maryland through GEICO, so your costs running the bike will be very low. It costs only about $0.50 in electricity to charge it, and often it is completely free at certain places.

Here is a video of my bike commuting on the Beltway:

https://youtu.be/D3rqdpwmd7c

You can see it more than keeps-up with traffic.

Do not confuse this with the 50cc-equivalent VX-2 model and similar electric bikes. This is a highway-legal bike and requires a motorcycle license (it is roughly equivalent to a 300-400cc bike up to its electronically limited top speed). There is optional firmware that increases that top speed to a little over 70mph (you can install it yourself if you like).

Charging to 80% takes about 2-3 hours at full power (you can set the power level so you can charge from pretty much any outlet, even low-current circuits). It is plug and ride - uses any household outlet at 120V or 240V (if you have a plug adapter, available for a few bucks online and you can make one from parts in Home Depot).

The bike comes with an upgraded Li battery pack with 18 Nissan Leaf cells, and LED for low and high beams and stop and running lights . Custom software is installed (and support for it is available) from:

http://www.vectrixsupport.com

The battery pack is this made with new 2013 Nissan Leaf cells (which have updated chemistry for better temperature range operation vs. Previous years). Just to get a pack like this delivered to the DC area costs roughly another $400 in shipping:

http://hybridautocenter.com/HAC4/index.php?option=com_hikashop&ctrl=product&task=show&cid=93&name=vectrix-lithium-conversion-9kw...

The bike is in virtually new condition, with only about 4,000 miles on the clock (only about 2,000 of them on the new battery). This is a 2009 model, bought new from the manufacturer in 2014 and I am the first and only owner. Runs great, needs nothing. The battery in this bike will last many thousands of miles (this is the same batter as in the Nissan Leaf, not junk you find in cheap knock-offs).

The bike comes with high-end parts from the factory, such as Italian Marzocci forks and Sachs rear suspension, Brembo calipers and disk brakes front and rear, top notch Pirelli/Michelin tires, etc. You won't find these on cheap bikes - this is reliable, name-brand stuff that works exceptionally well.

Easy to ride - no gears. Regenerative braking extends your range. A full-sized helmet plus a motorcycle jacket (or a couple of bags of groceries) fit under the seat (and as much more in the optional hard case in the rear). 12V power outlet in the front glove box (for GPS, phone, camera, etc.).

City range is probably well over 100 miles of riding around the speed limit (I never tried, I tire well before the bike runs out of battery in the city). Mixed range for me (about 200lb heavy) has been around 60 miles (50% highway, 50% urban and suburban traffic). Highway-only at 55-60 mph and steady speed I get over 40 miles comfortably. At full speed on the highway I have no idea, probably 30 miles or so. If you are a smaller person your range will be more - I am tall and heavy. Note that these numbers are with a very conservative about 60-70% usage of the maximum battery capacity, which ensures long battery life and a good safety margin for the battery against over-charging and over-discharging. The custom software is adjustable through a laptop computer with the included cable and configuration software (you supply the laptop), so if you are looking to get even more range at the expense of shorter battery life, you can do that.

Comes with a ton of important spare parts to last you the life-time of the scooter (would cost you well over $1,500 to acquire or replace these parts, and many are hard to find):
- spare motor controller (a $700 part only available mail-order from Europe)
- upgraded top-case/luggage rack (custom-built metal frame from a European vendor)
- spare OEM front and rear rims (new) with OEM tires (new)
- spare seats: one low-profile (good for short-legged folks) and one regular (like the one on the bike already)
- spare front forks (OEM, new, matched pair from the factory)
- spare pair of mirrors
- three (small sport screen - as pictured, plus a larger regular, and larger yet winter screen)
- spare OEM bearings, gear sets, fuses (these are expensive, 200A fuses!), grip rubber, and other misc. parts
- diagnostics software and cable ($250) that are necessary if you want to reprogram the bike in the future to use different controller, charger, battery, higher top speed software, perform diagnostics, etc.
- optional (have not decided if I'll include or not yet): a large top-end Givi hard case that fits a full-sized helmet and a motorcycle jacket (or two bags of groceries).

Located in Bethesda, MD 20814. Title in hand - one owner, me. You are welcome to test-ride if you have a valid motorcycle license and cash in hand. If you don't have a license, I can give you a ride on the back. Sorry, no exceptions.

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

A photo (with the sports screen):

Vectrix VX-1.jpg

Aircon
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Good ad! Good luck with the sale.

Have you ridden the Zero? What's it like? I consider it occasionally, but the lack of weather protection and luggage space turns me off them. Plus, the cheapest model is $25k+ here!

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Yes, I test-rode the 2014 models and was very impressed. The smaller battery S (9.8KW) with rebates and such is approaching the price point I am almost comfortable with. Still a lot of money, but I think I will make the jump. Especially if the Vectrix sells at a reasonable price. The eBay auction will come live later tonight, with lots more photos.

Yes, the lack of fairings and storage is a downside. I can add storage cases and hope someone will come-up with fairings. Also, the Vectrix is a little too small for me and I could never get fully comfortable on it - getting tired too quickly due to the not very ergonomic for me riding position. The Zeros felt much better for my size.

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Forgot to post asking price above. Looking to sell the bike only for $3K. I will include all parts except the top case for $3,5K. The top case is a $250 option whether you get the rest of the parts or not. I'll entertain best offers as well.

More photos at my eBay auction here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Other-Makes-VX1-/322065707087?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4afc9cb04f:g:pZAAAOSwGYVXBZG-&item=322065707087

Note that the headlight in the photos on eBay still shows with the original halogen bulb, now upgraded to LED low and high beams. And a couple of removable hi-viz stickers. Other than that, the same bike.

boeingpilot
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Forgot to post asking price above. Looking to sell the bike only for $3K. I will include all parts except the top case for $3,5K. The top case is a $250 option whether you get the rest of the parts or not. I'll entertain best offers as well.

More photos at my eBay auction here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Other-Makes-VX1-/322065707087?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4afc9cb04f:g:pZAAAOSwGYVXBZG-&item=322065707087

Note that the headlight in the photos on eBay still shows with the original halogen bulb, now upgraded to LED low and high beams. And a couple of removable hi-viz stickers. Other than that, the same bike.

You know, I was just about to pull the trigger to order batteries from hybridauto....... Don't suppose you'd like to swap a clean '09 with NiMh and cash for it?

PM me

Scott

2009 Vectrix VX-1 Leaf Conversion
1983 Lambretta Lynx
1980 Vespa P200
2013 VW Jetta Hybrid

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

PM sent. Thanks!

JimmyB
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Sorry to hear you're getting out of the Vectrix game. This is a stonking deal for a tried and tested package - GLWS :)

(if you want to sell the winter windshield separately give me a yell)

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Jimmy,

If the screen doesn't sell with the bike, I'll let you know.

prensel
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Sorry to hear you're getting out of the Vectrix game. This is a stonking deal for a tried and tested package - GLWS :)

(if you want to sell the winter windshield separately give me a yell)

I have one winter screen left for sale.
Tried, hated and removed it from my daily driver.

===================================
My contribution to EV in The Netherlands
- Vectrix VX-1 NiMh my2007 #307
- Vectrix VX-1 NiMh my2008 #2327 converted to 36S30P Li-Ion
- Vectrix VX-1 NiMh my2011 #3243
- Vectrix VX-1 Li my2011 #3228
- CityEl FactFou

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Why didn't you like it? For me, I too do not like it on its own as it is not tall enough for me and creates a lot of buffeting right where my head is. However, I tape to it about 4-5" of clear plastic during the Winter and then it covers me nicely - I would not ride without it in the colder months. Not that I ride much in the cold, but I'm talking say 50F-60F - I almost never go out if it is colder ;-)

The rest of the warm months - I keep the sports screen on - it feels the best in terms of buffeting on my head (the medium one also comes to a bad height for me). And the sports screen looks the best, IMO.

]

I have one winter screen left for sale.
Tried, hated and removed it from my daily driver.

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

PM sent.

A question or two and an observation: the charger is onboard for this incarnation of the bike, correct? And what you wrote in the Ebay listing about Leaf battery cell life isn't exactly correct: depth of discharge isn't the primary factor in Leaf cell degradation. Heat is #1, followed by calendar age, followed, possibly, by letting the cells sit at 100% charge or thereabouts for many hours or days. What is the cell maximum charge % set at now? Depth of discharge? It might be possible to safely get more range from the bike without increasing degradation by setting maximum charge to 90-95% (although this may raise balancing questions if 90%) and maximum DOD to 10%, which is ok as long as the pack is recharged shortly after this. Leaf cell life is pretty much "use it and/or lose it" and as long as the pack isn't charged hot it should be possible to use most of that capacity while it's there. The 2013 packs (apparently those built after 3/13, anyway) have improved 'age resistance' compared to the 2011/2012 packs, but they don't resist hot temps much, if any, better...

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Hi Leftie, excellent questions and observations!

Yes, onboard charger. The version in my bike is Runke, revision 4 (latest ever produced for these bikes, as far as I know). I put it in after the original ESD type charger failed about 1000 miles into my ownership. The flimsy fuse holder on that new Runke failed a few hundred miles after I installed it, so I replaced it with a sturdier version for $5 and it has been good since. See this for how I diagnosed and fixed it: http://visforvoltage.org/forum/14015-dead-runke-charger-hints-repair It is programmed with David's firmware from vectrixsupport.com. The MC and the ICM firmware are also from him and he can do mods to them as needed to fix bugs, add features, or accommodate requests for custom voltages (there is an app he recently developed to do much of it yourself through a computer interface, I have seen it but have not installed the updated firmware to support it yet). Custom free firmware is also available here through "team Laird": http://visforvoltage.org/forum/14072-lairds-team-files-vx1 and you can read some questions there about charge and discharge limits (try to ignore the personal attacks crap, the rest of the thread is good stuff).

Very good questions on the longevity. My charger is programmed to cutoff charge at 148V target. The actual measured battery voltage on the battery is between 146 and 147V. This is below "max". Absolute max I would consider 153V, corresponding to 4.25V per cell out of the 36 cells that make the 18 packs in the entire battery. Some have elected to charge to 150V, which I think is a little too high.

I usually ride to not lower than 130V, more often than not to about 135V or higher. I have programmed my gauge to correspond to only 40Ah capacity out of the available 60+. And I seldom empty it fully, so I am using way less than max capacity of the battery on each charge. I usually use no more than 50% between charges. The quoted 60 miles of mixed riding corresponds to something like 80% capacity. The bike is programmed to reduce power (under 125V or so, don't remember) and eventually cut-off entirely at low voltage (116 or so) to protect the battery. Those voltages are quite low, so this situation should be avoided as a regular habit. Watch the voltage gauge, and when it begins dipping much below 130, charge it.

I usually ride it immediately after charging and it usually stays in the mid 130V for storage and between rides.

Here is how my conversion to Li "quest" started: http://visforvoltage.org/forum/13767-nissan-leaf-modules-li-conversion-questions

PM sent.

A question or two and an observation: the charger is onboard for this incarnation of the bike, correct? And what you wrote in the Ebay listing about Leaf battery cell life isn't exactly correct: depth of discharge isn't the primary factor in Leaf cell degradation. Heat is #1, followed by calendar age, followed, possibly, by letting the cells sit at 100% charge or thereabouts for many hours or days. What is the cell maximum charge % set at now? Depth of discharge? It might be possible to safely get more range from the bike without increasing degradation by setting maximum charge to 90-95% (although this may raise balancing questions if 90%) and maximum DOD to 10%, which is ok as long as the pack is recharged shortly after this. Leaf cell life is pretty much "use it and/or lose it" and as long as the pack isn't charged hot it should be possible to use most of that capacity while it's there. The 2013 packs (apparently those built after 3/13, anyway) have improved 'age resistance' compared to the 2011/2012 packs, but they don't resist hot temps much, if any, better...

Rolli
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

I read you use the Dugas Firmware. How is the acceleration and the current limit? Do you know that?

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

I think the acceleration and current limit is based on the latest Li version from Vectrix. As has been mentioned on this forum, the consensus is that the initial acceleration may be a little softer than with the early NiMh firmware. In short bursts of acceleration, towards top speed, I have observed on the display max of about 180A or so. I never see such high amps at slow speeds, but it's hard to tell if it is just due to lag in the "smoothing" function reporting current on the display or if it actually draws less current from a dead stop. Acceleration seems very smooth and strong throughout the speed range, just from dead stop to maybe 20mph it is a little less snappy than with the oldest firmware. Still beats most "non performance" cars. I think that is better for the longevity of the MC and battery, while not reducing the performance of the bike much.

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

UPDATE: looks like I have a swap deal for the VX-1, so it is "SOLD", pending the actual swap happening over the next week or so.

Aircon
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

UPDATE: looks like I have a swap deal for the VX-1, so it is "SOLD", pending the actual swap happening over the next week or so.

swapping cash for the VX1? :)

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Swapping the VX-1 for another bike plus some cash will change hands too.

UPDATE: looks like I have a swap deal for the VX-1, so it is "SOLD", pending the actual swap happening over the next week or so.

swapping cash for the VX1? :)

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

On a very much related note, it looks like my 2015 Zero SR is also sold. ;-)

Aircon
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

On a very much related note, it looks like my 2015 Zero SR is also sold. ;-)

ahhhhhh....very good.

So....what are they like REALLY?

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

For the brief time I spent riding it, it was very fast, very competent, not so very comfortable, but not terrible for a person in normal physical shape. If they get the bugs truly out of these bikes and bring the price down, at least on the S version, they will be the best thing on the market. As it is, I'd prefer a bike I can actually ride. It will be interesting comparing the VX-1 to the ZEV 5000LA, which is much more apples-to-apples.

Aircon
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

For the brief time I spent riding it, it was very fast, very competent, not so very comfortable, but not terrible for a person in normal physical shape. If they get the bugs truly out of these bikes and bring the price down, at least on the S version, they will be the best thing on the market. As it is, I'd prefer a bike I can actually ride. It will be interesting comparing the VX-1 to the ZEV 5000LA, which is much more apples-to-apples.

what are the bugs?

Aircon
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

For the brief time I spent riding it, it was very fast, very competent, not so very comfortable, but not terrible for a person in normal physical shape. If they get the bugs truly out of these bikes and bring the price down, at least on the S version, they will be the best thing on the market. As it is, I'd prefer a bike I can actually ride. It will be interesting comparing the VX-1 to the ZEV 5000LA, which is much more apples-to-apples.

I think this might be the ZEV that competes with what Vectrix was.

http://www.zelectricvehicle.com/22.html

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

what are the bugs?

Defective onboard chargers, a few bad motors, and some miscellaneous other stuff that escapes me at the moment. Whatever the issue is with mine, Zero does replace the bad part(s). The dealer who sold me the bike should have repaired it, but they seem to have chosen multiple error code resets, with fingers crossed, instead. Zero has the BMS log for mine, but they didn't disclose a specific defect to the dealer I consulted on the third try. I'm assuming they want to see the more detailed log that can only be downloaded in a dealer service bay.

As for the ZEV, yes the drivetrain I had was nowhere near, in performance, that of the VX-1 with Leaf cells. It was at least in the same ballpark as the VX-1 with NiMH cells.

JimmyB
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Congratulations both! Kocho, you have to bring that Zero to my place at some point, I'd love to see it. I think Coleman Powersports just down the road from me has stopped being a Zero dealer, unfortunately.

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Yes, they are no longer a Zero dealer. It worries me a bit, since the next closest is almost an hour away near Annapolis. If that folds, the others are over 2 hours away in Richmond, PA, and DE.

Yeah, I can stop by once it is operational - it will be trailered straight to the Annapolis dealer next Monday if all goes to plan.

Congratulations both! Kocho, you have to bring that Zero to my place at some point, I'd love to see it. I think Coleman Powersports just down the road from me has stopped being a Zero dealer, unfortunately.

JimmyB
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Their site also lists a place in Gaithersburg that might be a bit closer? No experience of either dealer though!

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Could this be a new dealer? I'm almost certain it was not listed last week when I looked: it gave me the other 4 dealers but not the one in Gaithersburg. I'll check them out as they are very close to where I am in Bethesda. The shop web site does not list Zero as a brand they carry or service ...

Their site also lists a place in Gaithersburg that might be a bit closer? No experience of either dealer though!

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Kocho and I did the Zero SR / VX-1 swap today, after a surprisingly pleasant (considering what the Zero could potentially have done) ride in the country on each other's bikes. So I am now a Vectrix Owner. I never thought I'd be saying that, after making an offer on one on Ebay in 2012, then hastily retracting it two hours later, after belatedly researching the bike! I intend to treat the VX-1 gently, and use it only for recreational riding, not running errands or hauling groceries. I will charge it to Full only right before long rides, and will not charge it when it's hot, because Leaf batteries don't like heat. May the gods of motorcycling smile on Kocho and me, both.

Kocho
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

Hope the VX-1 proves reliable for you and that Zero can fix the SR for me! Ideally, the SR will only exhibit benign errors that can be ignored until late Fall, then Zero/dealer can be fixing it all Winter if they need to. But I am preparing that this might not be the case, unfortunately, and I will have to take it for repairs before I can ride it... And I miss the fairing and screen on the Vectrix - so exposed to wind on the SR...

LeftieBiker
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Re: For Sale - Leaf Vectrix VX-1

I was going to get a Slipstreamer "Turbo" windshield for the SR for cold weather, and a Slipstreamer "Spitfire" for warm. If you looked at my Suzuki at all, the little chest-height shield on that is the Spitfire. It does a decent job of reducing chest turbulence, at least for someone my height. The Turbo will supposedly fit as-is, but fits best if the lower portion is trimmed to clear the Zero "tank." This is according to people at the EMF Zero forum.

Oh,and the term I was looking for that describes the planetary ring gear astronomically is "Sun gear." I just remembered that 10 minutes ago. Although now that I think about it, maybe that *isn't* the ring gear...

EDIT: I just looked at the dealer SR pics to see if that seat tab was sticking outside the seat when I got it, and it was. You can see it in the first pic showing the whole right side of the bike. Either it's another assembly error like the stickers, or the seat was off at the dealership.

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