CAN bus

97 posts / 0 new
Last post
neopav
Offline
Last seen: 11 years 2 days ago
Joined: Saturday, March 28, 2009 - 04:31
Points: 14
Re: CAN bus

Hello Mik,

I am Paolo from Italy. We already talked together, if you remember...

I can say for sure that you just need the GridConnect USB-CAN Bus adapter without isolation. And for the cable, as the difference in price is so low, I bought the terminated one and I can confirm to you that this combo WORKS FLAWLESSY.

I say this after having successfully reflashed my VX-1 firmware with the latest Oct-08 version. So, you can go for sure...

Bye!

volts76
Offline
Last seen: 11 years 7 months ago
Joined: Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 19:38
Points: 62
Re: CAN bus

I also have the gridconnect USB-Can adapter which has a "Peak" lable with part # IPEH-002021 affixed to it. That part # indicates that it is not ISO. ISO version would be # IPEH-002022. My purple colored interface wire is not the terminating type. I disassembled the ends and found no resistors. FYI There are only three wires in there, Black, white, and shield.I too have done firmware updates

nergal
Offline
Last seen: 13 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 - 12:04
Points: 16
Re: CAN bus

Volts,

Do you have the vectrix software? or do you use other software for the update?

Mik
Mik's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 years 1 week ago
Joined: Tuesday, December 11, 2007 - 15:27
Points: 3739
Re: CAN bus

Thank you guys, most helpful, as usual!

I sum this up (also using the info which I got from gridconnect, and some glances from other CAN related sites) as this:

The purple cable probably works, terminated or not.

The PEAK USB CAN adapter is not terminated, and the isolated (500V) version of it is not necessarily needed, but safer, and does not cost that much more.

("Terminated" in CAN lingo refers to the presence of 120Ω resistors, somewhere. I think, very very simplified, these resistors make sure that the "high" or "low" signals on the bus do not last longer than intended; the signals "leak out" through the resistors so to say, instead of bouncing around the canbus system endlessly, causing reflected, confusing signals. Now you know as much about CAN as I do, and might be as misinformed! )

.
.

So, what do I make of it all?


I'll try to buy the isolated adapter, and the terminated cable, once I can afford it!

Galvanic isolation can only be good (if you don't know what you are doing, i.e. learning), and I hope I'll stay in that state of mind for much longer! I would not be surprised if I end up lending the adapter to someone needing to reprogram their Prius, either; or buy one myself.
The Vectux is hopefully not the last EV that I get my hands on!

And there is an excellent chance that the resistors in a "terminated" CAN cable are alrady soldered to just the right places when it arrives (eventually) at my place..... I should be easier for me to remove the resistors (and to remember where to put them when needed), than it would be to add them in the first place!

Thanks again, I feel much more confident now that I will order the right connectors (one day)!

This information may be used entirely at your own risk.

There is always a way if there is no other way!

jmap
jmap's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 years 6 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, September 3, 2008 - 10:30
Points: 340
Re: CAN bus

I want to buy one if I can get my hands on the Vectrix software... The diagnostic tool could turn out to be very handy. Does anybody have it?

RaDy
RaDy's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 03:16
Points: 334
Re: CAN bus

Yes, does anyone have the Vectrix software or can give a hint of where to find it?

arloguay
arloguay's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 4 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 09:47
Points: 26
Re: CAN bus

A random search produced this: http://stashbox.org/663190/scooterdiag.zip

I see a cople of interesting files, including candump.exe and scooterdiag.exe.

Unfortunately, I'm on a Mac! Could someone check this out on a pee cee and report back?

Arlo

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

I had a look at these files and they are very interesting. There are a couple of BMPs battery, wrench thermometer which seem similar to Vectrix logos.
Scooterdiag.exe >> couldnt get it to start asking for LIBMYSQL.DLL
Candump.exe > couldnt get it to start
wgnuplot.exe >> x/y diagram plotter by GNU project

There is a file called: fwfiles.ini wich contains locations of folders for:
C:\ScooterSoftware\ICM\Rev5\ICMR1005.hex
C:\Instrument Cluster Flash Files\8000-00809_01_D.s19
C:\ScooterSoftware\Charger\CHARGER_V2010_121107.hex
C:\ScooterSoftware\MotorController\Rev0\MCThermalProfile.hex
C:\ScooterSoftware\Tilt Drive\TILTDR1000T13.hex

There are some .ing files with pre-set messages but they could fit non Vectrix scooters too.

From what I see the files seem to be a copy from an existing PC installation. What the program scooterdiag.exe is good for is a questionmark. But it seems to interface to the CAN bus.

Norman

RaDy
RaDy's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 03:16
Points: 334
Re: CAN bus

To get it started you have to go inside the scooterDiag folder and look for a folder labeled "libmysql" , unzip it, and then copy the new unzziped file "libmysql.dll" to the folder named Ver 0.5 , and thats it, the program will start.

RaDy
RaDy's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 03:16
Points: 334
Re: CAN bus

After trying out different combinations and finally making it work, i can assure this "looks" exactly like the software used by Vectrix, so now that it works please someone who understands should be able to take some "juice" out of it.
Its cool, in the instrument panel section there are 2 modes of controling switches and brakes, one is from the bike itself and the other from the Pc. Offcourse without anything connected it doesnt work.
Next step : someone conncect it.
RaDy

R
R's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: Thursday, June 18, 2009 - 09:46
Points: 1768
Re: CAN bus

Open Source Vectrix.. OSV... interesting , but this is scary... I don't want to be the first one to fry a Vectrix.

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

To get it started you have to go inside the scooterDiag folder and look for a folder labeled "libmysql" , unzip it, and then copy the new unzziped file "libmysql.dll" to the folder named Ver 0.5 , and thats it, the program will start.

I followed your steps but still have the same error message. Do I have to copy the folder structure into a specific folder? I mean currently I stored the files like this:

c:\ScooterSoftware\
scooterdiag.exe

c:\ScooterSoftware\ScooterDiag\
all the other files from the ZIP

I am working on XP which should be the source of the problem.

Norman

ScooterDiag\

turok
turok's picture
Offline
Last seen: 3 years 10 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 00:27
Points: 338
Re: CAN bus

Open Source Vectrix.. OSV... interesting , but this is scary... I don't want to be the first one to fry a Vectrix.

better do it quick! as long as Vectrixcorp is around and the warranty is still valid:-)

I don't want to be the first either, but this is exciting!!

"doing nothin = doing nothing wrong" is invalid when the subject is environment

PhiRo
Offline
Last seen: 11 years 8 months ago
Joined: Friday, July 3, 2009 - 05:45
Points: 11
Re: CAN bus

I think the dll needs to be in the win32 folder.
If you install mysql from mysql.com you'll have that dll installed and ready.

RaDy
RaDy's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 03:16
Points: 334
Re: CAN bus

Ok, here goes exactly what i did.
1. i downloaded the zip file to my desktop (also with XP)
2. i unzipped it in the desktop, i get a folder called : scooterdiag
3. i open it and i find a folder called : ScooterDiag and a file called : scooterdiag.exe , i IGNORE the file
4. i open the folder ScooterDiag and find a zipped folder called : libmysql , i unzip it.
5. Now i open the folder libmysql and copy the file called : libmysql.dll to the folder called Ver 0.5
6. then you have to use the file called : scooterdiag.exe WHICH IS INSIDE THE Ver 0.5 folder, NOT the one outside.
7. Pandora's Box will open! for the good or for the bad?
Exciting

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

Ok, here goes exactly what i did.
1. i downloaded the zip file to my desktop (also with XP)
2. i unzipped it in the desktop, i get a folder called : scooterdiag
3. i open it and i find a folder called : ScooterDiag and a file called : scooterdiag.exe , i IGNORE the file
4. i open the folder ScooterDiag and find a zipped folder called : libmysql , i unzip it.
5. Now i open the folder libmysql and copy the file called : libmysql.dll to the folder called Ver 0.5
6. then you have to use the file called : scooterdiag.exe WHICH IS INSIDE THE Ver 0.5 folder, NOT the one outside.
7. Pandora's Box will open! for the good or for the bad?
Exciting

I followed the above steps and ADDITIONALLY had to copy following .dll into my system32 folder:
glut32.dll
PCAN_USB.dll
libmysql.dll

And voila, pandora's box also opened in the UK!

Norman

RaDy
RaDy's picture
Offline
Last seen: 6 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 03:16
Points: 334
Re: CAN bus

Cool, Norman, can you make something out of it? i have been trying everything out, and seems to work but useless if we cannot connect it!
I dont think i want to try it out yet anyway, my Vx-1 hasnt given me any problem, but maybe others can profit of it.
RaDy

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

there are some scary menus in the memory tab which seem to open the ability to write specific DATA into memory. Certainly this is a dangerous thing that should not be touched at this stage.

Other menus do a read memory (could not try) and then stores the memory dump into a file (works).

Most of the other fields seem to read data from CAN once connected > low risk to damage something as long you you do not push the send buttons.

Throttle and ICM test both came up with "Cannot find Language File". So something is in the rough here.
The "Transfer" tab is unclear to me, but might be to upload readings to a server.

And best of all the "Firmware Upgrade" tab solves all the questions about Fuel Cell's, you just need to upload the firmware and you got one, just kidding :-)

NOW the big question, who connects first?

Norman

AndY1
AndY1's picture
Offline
Last seen: 9 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 04:29
Points: 1071
Re: CAN bus

My repair engineer said, when he was diagnosing the bike, that the notebook has to be disconnected from the 220V plug at the time of connection, otherwise the connection won't work. And it truly didn't, when his notebook's battery was empty and we connected it to recharge.

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

My repair engineer said, when he was diagnosing the bike, that the notebook has to be disconnected from the 220V plug at the time of connection, otherwise the connection won't work. And it truly didn't, when his notebook's battery was empty and we connected it to recharge.

Andy1,

Thanks for bringing this up here. The reason why the laptop had to be disconnected from the mains might have to do with the "ground loop" a phenomenon Mik recently suffered from.

Norman

volts76
Offline
Last seen: 11 years 7 months ago
Joined: Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 19:38
Points: 62
Re: CAN bus

Here are a couple of commands that will work with Scooter Diag Ver 2.0

Equalization Command:

To initiate EQ charge:
Under Charge Tab
Type in 0x90 in Command box (0 = zero)
Type in 0x55 in Data box
Click on 'Send Charger Command'

To cancel EQ charge:
Type in 0x99 in Command box
Type in 0x77 in Data box
Click on 'Send Charger Command'

To do a "Memory Dump"
Under Memory Tab:
Address: type in 0 (zero)
Size: type in 0x800

Click on START tab

Opens and save to a location.

Mik
Mik's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 years 1 week ago
Joined: Tuesday, December 11, 2007 - 15:27
Points: 3739
Re: CAN bus
My repair engineer said, when he was diagnosing the bike, that the notebook has to be disconnected from the 220V plug at the time of connection, otherwise the connection won't work. And it truly didn't, when his notebook's battery was empty and we connected it to recharge.

Andy1,

Thanks for bringing this up here. The reason why the laptop had to be disconnected from the mains might have to do with the "ground loop" a phenomenon Mik recently suffered from.

Norman

Yes, I learned the easy way - frying an old laptop that was a bit past it, anyway!

Groundloop, Masseschleife, ... a nasty, ever possible phenomenon. I was smart enough to buy the opto-isolated USB-CAN adapter, but I did not apply that knowledge to the USB port that my battery analyser zapped my laptop through!

But just to be clear, it had nothing to do with the software or the neccessary hardware discussed in this thread. BUT, the "ground loop" might rear it's ugly sparkling head at any opportune microsecond.

SO GET THE OPTO-ISOLATED VERSION JUST IN CASE! It's only about 10% extra on the $500.- pricetag for the USB-CAN adapter!

Thats a bargain compared to what a ground loop might fry, e.g. the Vectrix charger.

This information may be used entirely at your own risk.

There is always a way if there is no other way!

Mik
Mik's picture
Offline
Last seen: 7 years 1 week ago
Joined: Tuesday, December 11, 2007 - 15:27
Points: 3739
Re: CAN bus

Here are a couple of commands that will work with Scooter Diag Ver 2.0

Equalization Command:

To initiate EQ charge:
Under Charge Tab
Type in 0x90 in Command box (0 = zero)
Type in 0x55 in Data box
Click on 'Send Charger Command'

To cancel EQ charge:
Type in 0x99 in Command box
Type in 0x77 in Data box
Click on 'Send Charger Command'

To do a "Memory Dump"
Under Memory Tab:
Address: type in 0 (zero)
Size: type in 0x800

Click on START tab

Opens and save to a location.

Can anyone work out what exact version number you are talking about? Is there a "Help/About" tab or something with a version number and / or date?

This information may be used entirely at your own risk.

There is always a way if there is no other way!

avronw
Offline
Last seen: 12 years 4 months ago
Joined: Sunday, September 21, 2008 - 20:00
Points: 35
Re: CAN bus

It looks like the ScooterDiag mentioned above is version 1.1. I vaguely recall hearing that there was in fact a version 2 or 2.x out, so this may be an older version, date 9 Oct 2007.

volts76
Offline
Last seen: 11 years 7 months ago
Joined: Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 19:38
Points: 62
Re: CAN bus

Open Scooter Diag. Click on the "About" tab.
Version 2.0 compiled on Feb 12, 2008
Version 2.1 compiled on Mar 20, 2009

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

Ok, let's try to get a risk assessment together:

1.) Assuming we use an optical adapter and no one is actually SENDING commands into CAN through the ScooterDiag (regardless what version). Is there a risk we could harm the bikes software/firmware permanently (i.e. even after a switch off/on by ignition key the SW wouldn't boot up anymore?

2.) I saw some first commands being proposed (i.e. trigger EQ) by sending data into the CAN. Obviously these commands would trigger a sub-routine of the bikes SW (i.e. start EQ charge). Do we know from other CAN experience that such commands could actually destroy the bikes SW? I mean, that the SW would not be able to re-start after switch off/on?

3a.) Is there a "all reset" button hidden somewhere that totally restarts the bikes computers?
3b) Is there an "all reset" SW command?

4) from other's CAN bus experience, are the buses (or actually the clients connected to CAN) sensitive to wrong CAN bus signals? Question is, if someone starts sending unsolicited commands into the bus, could this cause some of the CAN bus clients to fry or go into i.e. programming mode?
4a) Are there known CAN bus commands that could trigger such incidents?

Norman

marsupi
marsupi's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 - 08:06
Points: 51
Re: CAN bus

Hi all,
cool beans, I got my PCAN reader this week. Started playing with it.
He are a few screen dumps of the V diagnostic software
Dash_0.jpg
VectrixFirm_0.jpg
VectrixSum_0.jpg

07 Vectrix, Vego 600 mod.48V 800W, Arcade Alu E-Cycle 24VSachs Hub

tom5007
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 8 months ago
Joined: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 - 08:56
Points: 147
Re: CAN bus

Congratulations marsupi, tis looks excellent. Where did you get your PCAN reader from? And did you have issues with the ground connection? I mean the PC that you used was it connected to the grid or on battery? What a disappointment to see your fuel cell isn't activated :-)

Norman

R
R's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 months 2 weeks ago
Joined: Thursday, June 18, 2009 - 09:46
Points: 1768
Re: CAN bus

Superb! if i only could ride my vectrix with an lcd display showing temps and max min voltges... is there any tool/page where you can read some of the battery internal voltages?

marsupi
marsupi's picture
Offline
Last seen: 8 years 5 months ago
Joined: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 - 08:06
Points: 51
Re: CAN bus

As far as i can tell, there is no individual battery voltage measurement. the Battery monitoring has 2 cards one for each pack. These cards send information via the CAN bus and they have 6 temp sensors and a single voltage tap each. (well detailed by Mik here)
Aside from the obvious bus voltage the diagnostic tool gives access to the BMS voltage taps via the Data plot window as [BM1 SW H],[BM1 SW L],[BM2 SW H],[BM2 SW H] however I have not tried it yet.

FYI Norman I got my reader directly from Peak-System.com . here is the link for the distributors
I got the opto-isolated version that I connect directly to a Laptop, running on the battery

07 Vectrix, Vego 600 mod.48V 800W, Arcade Alu E-Cycle 24VSachs Hub

Pages

Log in or register to post comments


Who's online

There are currently 0 users online.

Who's new

  • momo4gou
  • wildfire_one
  • Jasmine
  • Jordyn
  • JCunnius

Support V is for Voltage