Moving to visforvoltage.org

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Moving to visforvoltage.org

Greetings fellow V members,

We the leadership committee of V is for Voltage have some regrettable news to announce. For quite some time now the V is for Voltage Community, including the current Moderator Team, has been experiencing difficulties due to inconsistent enforcement of policy and an overall lack of communication from the Management of V is for Voltage. There have been an increasing number of complaints to the Management Team about overly aggressive moderation, moderation without feedback to the member, and occasional inconsistent actions taken by different moderators. We are sorry to say your complaints have fallen on deaf ears as the Management Team is the problem. The Moderator Team has taken these complaints very seriously and we wish to inform you we were not involved in the recent round of poor moderation practices. As Moderator Captains, Webmasters and Moderators we find our work in managing conversations and enforcing current policy more difficult by the day as Management keeps changing the rules, changing the players, undoing our work, not communicating efficiently and acting in an inconsistent manner. However at the same time there were many things kept hidden from us, plans which were being made without our consultation, and so forth. Some postings had been made on the site which purported to be statements of Management decisions, but were not agreed on or even discussed with the V Team. The Management Team, George, has refused to answer repeated questions about these statements and other items of interest, he has not engaged us in meaningful conversation, and has dismissed our questions as 'nothing'. As a team and as members of the community we find this both disruptive and detrimental to the site's long term existence. Many of you have been down this road before. To some it may not even be evident but as the trusted keepers of this sites welfare we feel that something must be done to restore the site's integrity and insure that the site does not experience another downfall.

We do appreciate George Jones' contribution to this site, his vision and presence has in many ways been helpful, and we know he is a good person. However at the same time it has been determined that George Jones (a.k.a. Gman, Board Moderator, Stleride, vrecoveryteam, George J Jones Jr and many others) is harming to the life of this site, and we have taken steps to remove his influence. Effective immediately:-

- The site is now known as visforvoltage.org (rather than visforvoltage.net)

- The visforvoltage.net domain redirects to visforvoltage.org

- All of George Jones' accounts have had their privileges removed

- The site remains hosted on the same server, and there is continuity of content, user accounts and all settings.

As our first act of disclosure we will answer the following question. Who led to this action?
In alphabetical order and with an equal part;
Dave Brownscombe - user name - VT-01
David Herron - user name - Webmaster
Chas Stevenson - user name - chas_stevenson
Dave Wiley - user name - Elrod

We hope you all notice an improvement. If not you know how to contact us. Actually if you like the changes go ahead and mention that too. We thrive on praise.

Thank you,
The V-Team

ArcticFox
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

You guys frigg'n ROCK!

Happy Birthday visforvoltage.org!

//perso.orange.fr/magicludovic/images/Smiley_bravo_01.gif)//www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ernaehrung/food-smiley-004.gif)//www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/party/party-smiley-048.gif)

<table border="0" style="border:1px solid #999999; padding:10px;"><tr><td>
<a href="http://www.BaseStationZero.com">[img]http://visforvoltage.org/files/u419...
[size=1][color=black]www.[/color][color=#337799]BaseStationZero[/color][co

echuckj5
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Good, should have been done long ago.

Thanks David,

chuck

[b]AGM BATTERIES[/b]

jdh2550_1
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Woo hoo! Good news guys. I know it probably wasn't an easy decision.

The forum is dead - long live the forum!

I pledge to keep my posts on topic and useful (with only a dash of cynicism every now and then ;-))

John H. Founder of Current Motor Company - opinions on this site belong to me; not to my employer
Remember: " 'lectric for local. diesel for distance" - JTH, Amp Bros || "No Gas.

Alias
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Way to go!! change is good ;)

Lisa ~

sandorszabo
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

I left because a part of the forum was beginning to remind my of a faction fight - and as a prod to change.

I'm not a major player: but I welcome the opportunity to rejoin.

andrew
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

David (Webmaster),
I trust you made the best decision. I think I speak for most of the community in saying that I fully support your stated actions.

I felt that something was going wrong with the forum, and someone had to do something. Gman did fail to take the initiative and explain his actions, though I never had anything against him. It seemed that either a lot of members were out of line, or someone with administrative controls was out of control. I still don't have a clear opinion on which it was, or more likely both. In any case, I think we all here owe you much gratitude for taking charge and doing whats necessary to keep the community alive. Thanks!

[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/587-my-kz750-electric-motorcycle-project]KZ750 Motorcycle Conversion[/url]
[url=/forum-topic/motorcycles-and-large-scooters/588-fixing-my-chinese-scooter]900 watt scooter[/url]
Pic from http://www.electri

Fechter
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Excellent work David!

I just wish this had happened a long time ago, before I moved shop.
This will certainly be the best improvement this site has seen since its conception.

NickF23
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

It might be an idea for someone who knows Gman and has his address to ask him to put a link up or redirect visforvoltage.org as its not going anywhere at the moment and some people will not know where we are.

Buckeroo Bob
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Buckeroo Bob is back on board and ready to learn more electric tricks.

reikiman
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Hi Bob, and everybody else. I appreciate everybody's response and pray that this transition will be smooth for everyone.

- David Herron, The Long Tail Pipe, davidherron.com, 7gen.com, What is Reiki
- Electrified Electra To

drivin98
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

I was worried you all had disappeared when the site didn't load up this morning. Glad you're all still around. I'm new and don't know what the problem was (and really don't want to) but I hope this was the best resolution.
Maybe this will help the board move forth and gain more users. I'm a little surprised there aren't a lot more people here already. I'd been digging around the internets for a while before I found this site.

Game on.

Sturdly
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

I've been kind of drifting away myself what with Summer weather and being able to enjoy my E Blast.

Seemed like lately every time I checked in the tenor was pretty negative and a bunch of carping going on about some of the kids not playing nice. If I want that I can go visit my family. :)

Hope those days are behind us and we can rebuild on a more solid foundation.

Thanks for pulling the plug on all the shenanigans.

zx12r
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

cool a bit of good ol fashioned cyber biffo

i havnt been around for a while as i have been concentrating on my electric helicopters, or more importantly my wallet has
my electric bike is still going strong, rode home from work today in gail force winds (that sucked, i think without the motor i would of got off and walked)

glad to see its all sorted

p.s. i brought a new helicopter 3 weeks ago, it has cost now $2000 (www.beamheli.com) and is almost ready to be flown, i still havnt told my wife and she still hasnt checked the internet banking and noticed my deception (my paypal frensy), i expected to get caught within a week, but its starting to drag on, i feel like the longer it goes on the more pissed she is gonna be.

Help

LOL //i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/LaPacka/surprise.gif)//i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/LaPacka/puke.gif)//i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd304/BeamE4/t_fan2.gif)

DSCN1526.jpg
DSCN1475.jpg

davew
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

i brought a new helicopter 3 weeks ago, it has cost now $2000 (www.beamheli.com) and is almost ready to be flown, i still havnt told my wife and she still hasnt checked the internet banking and noticed my deception (my paypal frensy), i expected to get caught within a week, but its starting to drag on, i feel like the longer it goes on the more pissed she is gonna be.

That's a nice looking machine. It might just be worth going without noogie for a very long time. :-)

"we must be the change we wish to see in the world"

woody113
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Right behind you guys.

Cheers
Woody
www.elationebikes.com.au

davew
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

I just watched the video for the copter. Amazing! I suspect they have a lot more freedom with an electric design not having to worry about fuel flow. The guy flying the thing must have had lots, and lots of practice. It's worth checking out the video for those of you who have a few minutes to spare. I watched "beam outdoor fly."

"we must be the change we wish to see in the world"

zx12r
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

i think you should have a look at this one (Beam E4) same as mine (i currently have the only one in Australia, as they are not yet available for purchase in Australia)
http://video.helifreak.com/?subpath=Gathering07&filename=WattsBeam-Gathering07.wmv

you may need to register to be able to download it

its bobby watts who is one of the best
one of the best flights of a small heli that i have ever seen

you should also search for a few vids of my other heli TREX600 electric
much bigger and much more impressive

my electric bike is a elation conversion
it was a cheap bike and just about everything has broken on it since i did the conversion
about the only stuff that hasnt broken is the elation kit and the frame
everything else i have had to upgrade due to wear and tear

i never saw any of the trouble that brought this move about (ORG)
but i can imagine so well done for taking control

cheers
and yes maybe no noogie for long long time, maybe definately
i guess im screwed

DSCN1180.jpg
DSCN1091.jpg

and my charging station

DSCN1103.jpg

borgbike
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Cool! I'm on board.

FYI. visforvoltage.org is not automatically redirecting to the dot org address. I was lost all day and was jonezing! (David H, ignore my e-mail asking what's up.) I imagine a lot of people experienced the same thing. I think the e-mail message that was sent to me as a registered user disappeared into spam oblivion.

Dave

reikiman
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Throughout the day off-and-on I've been searching for links to V.net and working to get them changed to V.org. This should help in the future to help people find the site. Unfortunately you may be right that the email sent this morning didn't reach everyone (spam filters) and in any case it came out badly formatted (sigh).

- David Herron, The Long Tail Pipe, davidherron.com, 7gen.com, What is Reiki
- Electrified Electra To

Verna
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

reikiman,
You are aware the name "V is for Voltage" is a legal name registered with the MO SOS 12/26/2006?
https://www.sos.mo.gov/BusinessEntity/soskb/Filings.asp?1988327

reikiman
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

You are aware the name "V is for Voltage" is a legal name registered with the MO SOS 12/26/2006?

Yes. The December 2006 registration has expired, and George has refiled as of a few days ago.

Are you aware there seems to be very little real effect from registering such a name? http://www.sos.mo.gov/business/corporations/faqs.asp says "Filing or registering a fictitious name for your business does not afford or reserve any exclusive rights to the use of that name. There is no limit to the number of entities which may register the same fictitious name."

- David Herron, The Long Tail Pipe, davidherron.com, 7gen.com, What is Reiki
- Electrified Electra To

ArcticFox
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Verna = Gman

"V is for Voltage" is not a legal name registered with the MO SOS 12/26/2006.

"V is for Voltage" is a registered trademark name that Gman (George J. Jones Jr., 6009 Odell St., Saint Louis, MO 63139-2631) fraudulently reserved (not registered) as designation of George's own corporation, limited partnership, LLC, or limited liability partnership. As that link clearly states, his statement of affirmation, signed and dated by him are subject to Missouri's Perjury laws Section 575.040, RSMo:

Offenses Against the Administration of Justice
Perjury.

575.040. 1. A person commits the crime of perjury if, with the purpose to deceive, he knowingly testifies falsely to any material fact upon oath or affirmation legally administered, in any official proceeding before any court, public body, notary public or other officer authorized to administer oaths.

2. A fact is material, regardless of its admissibility under rules of evidence, if it could substantially affect, or did substantially affect, the course or outcome of the cause, matter or proceeding.

3. Knowledge of the materiality of the statement is not an element of this crime, and it is no defense that:

(1) The defendant mistakenly believed the fact to be immaterial; or

(2) The defendant was not competent, for reasons other than mental disability or immaturity, to make the statement.

4. It is a defense to a prosecution under subsection 1 of this section that the actor retracted the false statement in the course of the official proceeding in which it was made provided he did so before the falsity of the statement was exposed. Statements made in separate hearings at separate stages of the same proceeding, including but not limited to statements made before a grand jury, at a preliminary hearing, at a deposition or at previous trial, are made in the course of the same proceeding.

5. The defendant shall have the burden of injecting the issue of retraction under subsection 4 of this section.

6. Perjury committed in any proceeding not involving a felony charge is a class D felony.

7. Perjury committed in any proceeding involving a felony charge is a class C felony unless:

(1) It is committed during a criminal trial for the purpose of securing the conviction of an accused for murder, in which case it is a class A felony; or

(2) It is committed during a criminal trial for the purpose of securing the conviction of an accused for any felony except murder, in which case it is a class B felony.

Some notes to think about:
> George reserved "V is for Voltage" with the state of Missouri on 12/26/2006. At that time the name was already publicly known and copy written © to another entity since before 7/1/2006 as the name used for visforvoltage.com. There are no public records found in or out of the state of Missouri that show relinquishment of rights for "Visforvoltage" to anyone. Therefor the statements and affirmations provided and signed by George are knowingly false and subject to legal action against George under Missouri state laws Section 575.040 (perjury).

> That reservation (not registration) is limited to 60 days and shows expiration on 2/24/2007 and is therefore nullified.

> As known, "visforvoltage" is a fictitious "trademarked" name (ie: a DBA, unlike "Martha Stewart"). Filing or registering a fictitious name for your business does not afford or reserve any exclusive rights to the use of that name. There is no limit to the number of entities which may register the same fictitious name. So, again, just because I point at McDonald's doesn't mean I own it.

> Handwriting analysis of the document's signature shows strong signs of schitzophrenia of the signator:

People diagnosed with schizophrenia usually experience a combination of positive (i.e. hallucinations, delusions, racing thoughts), negative (i.e. apathy, lack of emotion, poor or nonexistent social functioning), and cognitive (disorganized thoughts, difficulty concentrating and/or following instructions, difficulty completing tasks, memory problems).

> Should George admit to mental disability, he would not be subject to perjury laws, but also would not be able to sign legal documents by himself as those would be instantly nullified since there is no legal standing for people who have no frigg'n brains.

> Marquita Godier also lives at 6009 Odell.

**All information presented above is from publicly accessible records found online and therefor does not fall under any privacy laws.

<table border="0" style="border:1px solid #999999; padding:10px;"><tr><td>
<a href="http://www.BaseStationZero.com">[img]http://visforvoltage.org/files/u419...
[size=1][color=black]www.[/color][color=#337799]BaseStationZero[/color][co

Webmaster
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

I just want to say a couple things related to the comment by ArcticFox..

First, just because we took this action with changing the domain name is not an excuse to gang up on George. At the same time, what ArcticFox has said is his words.

Second, I think a couple things he's said are questionable -- how can a messy signature imply schizophrenia? I do know about handwriting analysis, and the handwriting analysts I've met use more than a signature to make whatever conclusions they reach.

- David Herron, http://www.7gen.com/

gushar
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Thanks guys. I knew something was up. I got the email and now I found where to go.

I agree with UsaTracy and others. Everyone will have a point of view on this change. Let's get onto what we all come here for...great info, EV help and opinion/interest sharing, etc.

Thanks again to the team for getting things changed and running!

Gushar :-)

Gus

pat
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

reikiman,
I suggest you get some real legal advice, the document linked is not a fictitious name registration, but a name reservation for a new entity.
In this case there is no need to file a fictitious name registration unless a person was doing business as (DBA) V is for Voltage and this is not the case here.

NickF23
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Pat,

Any legal action would be pointless as if the case had any merit or even got to court we'd all just move to another domain. The reasons for the move must be clear from everyone's responses; people were unhappy with George managment style and wanted a change. David (reikiman) has said that George and friends are welcome to post here and contribute to the site here, nobody is being excluded.

ktrough
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Re: Moving to visforvoltage.org

Ken Trough here. When I started the Voltage Forums, I said that if I were to decide not to be involved at some point in the future, I would hand over the reigns to the community. I am happy to see that David Herron and company are keeping the lights on. I know quite well how much time, effort and money go into it.

As far as the term "V is for Voltage", it has been in copyrighted use since 2001, but I never made it a registered trademark. I created the original V is for Voltage website, and I have personally published a ton of information under that banner. http://tinyurl.com/33a5ko

As the originator and owner of the term, I hereby publicly state for the record that I grant unlimited use of the phrase to David Herron and his team for use in promotional or fundraising purposes that benefit the site or the community. Explicit public permission for use from the term originator should override any subsequent claims or control attempts.

Further, I have pointed visforvoltage.com to this site in continued support of this community.

I am not "back" however and I will not see any responses to this post, so don't bother asking me a bunch of questions. Here is a synopsis of my past year:

Things are going quite well for me personally. I put the EV business in semi-hibernation and am only working on R&D on a handful of new designs. I am not dependent on the EV stuff for my income any more so that reduced my stress levels by several orders of magnitude.

Not being involved with the forums or with any sort of online publishing has been very good for me this past year as well. There is WAY too much unnecessary conflict in the EV community. My experience with the NEDRA board last year was the last straw. I grew very weary of butting heads with people who supposedly had the same goals I did, but seemed to block or attack most of my efforts. I got tired of being criticised for promoting new technology ideas. I simply want to work cooperatively with people of similar goals and intentions. Being a "leader" in the EV community makes you a huge target for attack and criticism (something I am sure you are all well aware of), and while I generally shrug off criticism pretty well, it did accumulate and add stress in my life. I decided to become an innovator and example rather than a "leader" and so far it is working out very well for me.

My stress is gone and my time is productive again. I will almost certainly return to web publishing in the future, but probably not an exclusive EV type site like before. My thinking was that when I started V is for Voltage, there was no widespread public will for vehicular change and no widespread public awareness of EVs and other alternatives. I felt that I could personally make a huge difference in raising awareness and supporting the pioneer online community. Now, with the feature films, new focus on the environment, the war, and the high gasoline prices, conditions have changed. While a massive move away from gasoline vehicles will take some time to manifest, public awareness is higher than ever before and desire for alternatives is higher than ever before. As such, I don't feel the same personal drive to constantly promote that topic exclusively online. I am working on a new publishing project that will have some EV aspects, but will cover a variety of other topics as well on the subject of lifestyle enrichment. It should drop early next year. You'll hear about it when it happens I am sure.

As far as building/selling EVs goes, I discovered that customers are a royal pain in the backside. I really don't want to deal with them in a general sense. As a result I am focusing on development of ideas for licensing as well as doing some high profile celebrity builds to promote my designs. Besides the celebrity stuff, I am currently working on an electric recumbent, a couple of electric chopper designs, a long range/high power stand-up scooter design, a sport bike conversion, and a 1979 Corvette Stingray conversion. That will keep me busy for the rest of 2007 and most of 2008.

I ceased my involvement with the Dragonfly design group at the end of last year due to the fact that (from my perspective) I was doing everything myself and wasn't getting any meaningful build support from the other group members. When I asked for a break from the group (with the intention of returning after a month or two off), I was soundly and unreasonably attacked by the group leader for abandoning/betraying them (when all I was asking for was a break). It became clear to me that with such leadership, I didn't want any further association with the group and I quit them as a result. I hope they continue to develop the project (and I totally wish them well), but I am not going to be involved with them in any way. Working with other people is fine, but depending upon them has not worked well for me, so I am back to self sufficiency and that is working out so much better.

I wish everyone well and good luck with all your EV projects!

-Ken Trough
V is for Voltage founder
inactive member

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