ERider 8000W scooter - Australia (similar to xm5000li)

Hi, yes you are right! It must be absolutely add loctite and add a against nuts, I also had this problem on my engine 8kw and sevcon 180A now that is ok! I also add a few thing to super to cool the sevcon especially l'summer! I sent the photos to MR chen See this

The new controller is a Sevcon XX and I notice that it get very hot when I ride
The controller is located under the sit , then it is enclosed and there is no air circuit to cool it.
I decide to find a solution to keep the Sevcon cool .

here it is :
a Water coller Corsair H60, this device is design for computer, I have to adapt it to my Scooter
I separate the 2 parts and replace the two pipe to adapt this model in the scooter.
see the picture below :
the water block/pump is sealed on the aluminium back side of the Sevcon controller

The water block pump in the battery compartment (the Sevcon is placed over the corsair block, and assembled with thermal paste)

remplacement of the pipes, and refilling

the radiator is place in the front of the scooter

The result is very efficient , the Sevcon never warm over 30 °c , and the hight the speed is , cooler is the Sevcon !

a deep review here : http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/43627-corsair-h60-high-performance-liquid-cpu-cooler-review.html

Bye

LAurent

Laurent, do you have the ability to turn the controller cooler off and on? Or does it run constantly? (and zap power through the pump and fan)? I live in Phoenix AZ and the temp today is around 111 F. If I ride about 12 miles with considerable climbing, my controller overheat will come on, and it will need 5 to 10 minutes of cool down. I have seriously considered adding some type of evaporative cooler.

In any temps under 100 F, my controller never overheats. But it is mounted on the outside of my 4000li where it gets ample air flow. I am at 11,555 miles and counting.

Hello,
the pump and the ventilo waterproof operates in 12 volts i connect the pump and the fan on the power of the key, it works only when the sevcon

starts in road the cooling is very impressive! Last Saturday I went through 70 km of motorway (cells 90 AH) points to to 105 kmh (GPS) the

cycle analyst has indicated to me between 80 and 100A in continued and the temperature after 35 km was 28.5 degrees only! The more you roll

quickly the sevcon cools! Impressive! I have check the probe, i thought that it didn't work, I go the hand under the sevcon and it was barely

warm! The watercooling very effective! You can install without worries you will be very happy

Bye

laurent

ps: I have no more to cut the sevcon since I install this system, before the sevcon cut when the sevcon was very very hot!

More than 50 degrees

Hello
to everyone, my sevcon is a 180A it heats up much more than the 350A!
From 80A in continues it heats up a lot! Now I can push to more than 100A in continues on 30km the temperature still remains the same,
the 350A is certainly the ideal!
But it remains too expensive!
For that which is of the pump it is well set there can be no water on the cells I have done everything for that to be waterproof

bye

laurent

I just want to know, has anyone else installed a blanket around their batteries to keep them warm?

Sorry, Phil for apparently having withheld this info for so long, but I did not find heating blankets fitting my battery pack, so I made my own. I used an 8m long heating cable with around 115W heating power and designed a meander that perfectly covered every aluminium end plate of my GBS-four-packs both left and right side plus around 40cm of "wasted" cable length from one to the other side.
I made myself a cardboard template with the pattern for one cell row and marked the meanders on a piece of sytrofoam floor insulation with an alumized backing. I carefully stuck the heating cable onto the aluminized backing with aluminium foil adhesive tape. Here is a pic of the LH side completed:

Below it is the marked RH side. I decided it would be easier to first slide in the finished bit on the right side between battery box wall and cell rows and configure the RH side in situ, but it turned out I had to stick it on before having shoved it back under the frame - no chance to fiddle with cable meanders and aluminium foil sticky tape under that maze of tubing and cables. It was flexible enough after having completed the RH side to squish it in there completed.
I had to take out the last three cell rows in order to unstick the front three from the double-sided adhesive on the battery box floor so I could move them first to the right side for ample insertion space for the LH heating, and v.v. for the right side. I was too stressed out to unhook all those myriads of cables and take the whole battery out. But like this it worked pretty well. After having put the last three rows in again I tucked in 2 to 4 additional insulation layers on the RH side in order to create a snug contact of each meander section to it's aluminium cell pack end plate while catering for the uneaven battery box side walls.
The white non-heating connector cable emerges from the rear right corner of my battery bay. I made a small cutout in the front edge of the lid in my underseat compartment for the connector cable.

Of course I had done numerous tests before I put all this together to ensure the cable would not heat up too much and melt or even burn something. Once it was installed I did a test heat up run in the garage as well as the cooling curve after having unplugged the heating and walked to the garage every half hour over 8h to log the battery temp. This data I then took to make myself a forecasting tool in Excel in order to find the ideal starting time to program my timer so that I would have approx. +15°C in my battery by 7:20 a.m., regardless of the ambient temp.
Only with the help of this heating did I manage to get through the in part extremly cold winter this year with my GBS battery. It was reduced to a heap of rubbish whith a core temp. of even just 0°C. With +15°C core temp. I no longer dropped the voltage to below 65V fully charged during my first acceleration out of town.
But the heating DID take it's toll on my riding energy consumption, though not as much as it theoretically should have because the battery chemistry worked with higher efficiency with the warmer battery.
The 115W might seem a little weak, but I am able to bring the battery approx. 25 Kelvin (degree C) above ambient temp. within 10 hours. So with the coldest morning at -18°C I only managed around 8°C in the battery :-)

Of course if you would also put a heating matt UNDER the battery pack plus some insulation below a lot more could be done, but also a lot more electrical energy would have to be invested (wasted?)...

So to cut along story short: I still think your CHL do not really need a heating if it does not get much colder than -10°C in Canberra, but do as you please :-)

Update: 2 July 2012 @ 7232km: Amanda and I rode 28km to do our motorcycle Provisional licence on Saturday and managed to charge up while waiting for our turn. We passed, luckily, and rode back home. All up we rode 71km that day. Lots of interest in the scooters and people were amazed with the speed when we did the emergency stop test from 30km/h. Yep, Brakes work real good! We saw 3 crashes and one girl taken away in an ambulance so it was an action packed day.

Congratulations on your provisional motorcycle licences :-) But WHAT ON EARTH happens at such a test at your end that three crashes happen and one girl gets injured badly enough to be taken away by ambulance?! That sounds somewhat reckless to me, to be a test for a provisional motorcylce licence?

Maybe the "ABS" on the brakes stands for "Alternative Braking System", as a complement to the regen ;-)

Phil, add about 12°C to your temperetures, and that will give you an idea how far my GBS dip at my max. current of 140 to 170A (depending on the battery temp...) :-)

I see, the tests you described are also part of the curriculum and riding test for the motorcycle licence here in Germany. But it appears you have no real riding "school" with an instructor, either on his own bike or in a car, following behind and connected via wireless intercom? That testing circuit was the first thing for me to do to give my instructor an idea what I was capable of already, and we repeated it once or twice between the normal riding lessons (city, country roads and even Autobahn) before the pratcial test came along. Then it was no big deal really :-)
To bad for that girl, such things do happen. I once almost had a similar incident when turning around to get back to the slalom circuit, but I was ON the bike, and immediately remembered my instructor's words that "the clutch is a bikers best friend" in case things get to fast too quickly :-)
Now I was of course very fortunate to having had a REAL ABS on the driving school's BMW GS650 for the emergency stop "rehearsals", and I must say I was time and again blown away by the immense breaking that came about using that system to it's fullest. BMW were the first to implement proper ABS in motorcylces, and it shows.

Concerning the Chinese "ABS", let me quote the assembler of our bikes: "China ABS is low quality and it never pass EEC testing"

People say it simply consits of a kind of overpressure bleed valve, limiting maximum braking pressure to a value that would normally not allow locking up the front wheel on a dry and clean road. The best thing next to a REAL 2-wheel ABS is to have tires that stick to the road come what may. I am VERY fortunate to have such a marvel of modern rubber alchemy at least on my front wheel already, and come the next winter I will put another one of those on the motor too. The front tire is so good that even on a whet road I can pull the handle as hard as I may - the bike simply stops frightfully quickly.

But WHAT ON EARTH happens at such a test at your end that three crashes happen

The test is mostly SLOWLY weaving in and out of cones and performing a very tight u-turn, then an emergency stop at 20-30km/h and dodge an obsticle (half a tennis ball) at 20-30km/h.

*snip*

I'm happy to say that I did the emergency stop test at 24km/h and the required distance is 3.8m and the erider 8000w with me on it stopped at 3.0m

Oh and the front brake caliper that say "ABS" means NOTHING. Before the test, the bike had to pass a "technical inspection" and the mechanic said theres no way that is ABS because it has no "slip sensor". He said it was more of a antihammer device at best. And sure enough during a 20km/h full speed lock up, BOTH wheel skidded meaning the ABS units on these scooters are not ABS as we know it.

The test here is more stringent,

to get your bike license, after riding around with the fellow giving the test, they also test your braking skill

you have to brake from 50kmh within 12 metres, without locking up the brakes
An experienced rider can actually do it in 8 metres

when braking, only use the rear brake until your mass has transfered to the front

because it is a scooter, this next bit is somewhat harder, but use your body to hold the scooter straight, you won't have enough mass on the rear wheel (if it is still in contact with the ground) for it to hold the bike straight for you

Matt

Hi,
Regarding the GBS batteries I can pretty much confirm MERoller - I can get down to below 70V in pertty warm weather (say 15 C) during accelereation.
I doesnt seem to hurt performance though.

A bit OT but nevertheless interesting about the licences.
Here in Sweden we have a fairly complex system with the motorcycle licences.
When you are 15 you can get a permit to drive a EU-moped (max 50cc/45 km/h)
When you are 16 you can take a light motorcycle license, you are then eligible to drive up to a 125cc motorcycle (max 11 kw).
When you are 18 you can take the "medium" size motorcycle license, driving up to 600cc and 25 kw of power.
And then when you are 21 you can take your full motorcycle license.

The license itself is provisional for two years, where really the only restriction is that if you loose it (for speeding etc) you need to retake it, whereas after two years you will just temporarily loose it´in such cases.

To take a licence you need to take theory test and then a practical test. Some of the above also have special tests such as "safe driving", which you need to have undergone.
The practical test is partially in traffic (country roads, city and if applicable highway) but also a driving skill test, which seems similar to what you have described above with a slalom test, slow controlled driving, and braking from 50,70 and 90 km/h to standstill without locking up the brakes etc.

Once you have taken your license, and passed your inital two years you have it for life. Unless your health status prevents your from driving, and I also think that some very serious traffic offenses may lead to a court retracting your driving permit.

/K

A bit off-topic, but back in the late 1970's, I applied for and received a permit to drive a full-sized tractor-trailer - a car hauler, the kind that is a huge rectangle and can be stacked on cargo ships, connected to a "tractor" unit with a 10 speed transmission and a two-speed rear axle unit that had to be used together. I answered about 10 questions correctly and from that point was able to legally drive the transporter as long as a fully licensed driver was with me. No training course at all - that occurred out on the highway! I can still remember driving it, filled with vehicles, in busy interstate traffic. I didn't ever get my license, and was never extremely proficient at back-parking it, but it certainly was an interesting experience! If people only knew with whom they were sharing the highway...

The processes Klas described for Sweden are pretty much identical to what happens here in Germany. It cost me, a two-wheel rider all my life (first rode on the fuel tank of dad's Honda CB 185 probably around age 3...), and for the last 26 years mopeds of the 50cc/50km/h class, a whopping 1 423.64 € to get my full motorcycle licence. I could do that directly as I am over 21 years old :-) So I could actually ride a Suzuki Hayabusa if I pleased, but I enjoy life far too much...

Phil, you timed that test perfectly :-) But you said it was only a provisional licence. What makes it permanent-ish?

From the goggle camera videos you made I could tell you already have motorcyling instintcs firmly in place, which is a good thing and justifies the shortcut imho.

That´s almost exactly what it costed me aswell when I took the license in 2008!
I have also been riding 2-wheelers most of my life before that (I´m 48).

hi pcarlson
am nearly ready to buy the lightning bolt . for carrying me and wife ..both retired .. sounds like you had lots of problems which we dont want as we live in vic high country .. are they more reliable now.. one idea for where we live is for a one wheel trailer to carry a small generator .. your view would be much appreciated

thanks for that answer.. on ebay theres a single wheel bike trailer which i think could adapt to lightningbolt had a look at sinewave generator weight is 23kg the trailer can load 40kg .. anybodys thoughts pos or neg would be good cheers alan

thanks for that answer.. on ebay theres a single wheel bike trailer which i think could adapt to lightningbolt had a look at sinewave generator weight is 23kg the trailer can load 40kg .. anybodys thoughts pos or neg would be good cheers alan

I don't understand why people who buy electric scooters would want a dirty, inefficient generator chugging along behind them, even if only some of the time. That isn't a troll post - I genuinely don't understand it. You could buy a C.A.R.B. certified 150CC scooter, or tow another battery pack and a charger instead...

wow its only if it runs out of charge as we plan to go about 60klms a day camping no power in the bush you having your period?

its only if it runs out of charge as we plan to go about 60klms a day camping no power in the bush

an inverter genset in the ~2kw size is generally 400g/kwh (360 if you pay big bucks for a honda)

a non-inverter genset is more efficient, but of course bigger and heavier

that gets you roughly 3L/100km which is reasonable (assuming 54wh/km, which some owners are reporting)

what speed are you planning on doing 60km a day at?

there are ways to hack an inverter genset to charge the battery directly, it just depends upon how often you plan on doing it for it to be worthwhile

unless you are planning on using the genset for something else aswell, using a petrol scooter may be more efficient

Matt

BMS is on its way to me to, maybe we can keep each other updated regarding any installation issues?